 |
|
| Author |
 Topic  |
|
dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
 Posted - 19 May 2008 : 03:04:57
|
Ebou4. Your comment above is the kind that led to the collapse of NADD. While I agree that the opposition cannot win without UDP, it is also equally true that any other coalition cannot win without other parties. This is simply the truth and the facts of the 2006 election has proven that.
A coalition of UPD and NRP was formed and they failed dismally as well just as NADD did. The coalition of UDP and NRP from Hamat Bah and Many others' perspective was that when you put together UDP the supposed largest tribe and Fulas argueably the second largest, then you have a winning formula. This coalition turned out to a deception and miss calculation of the political dymentions in the Gambia.
Yes, without UDP no winning formulae, but also yes, without NADD no winning formula. So what are we celebrating for when either coalition will not win?
I have always argued that it is a political sucide to say without one party or one man, things will not work. We have to be realistic and put our individual political dreams aside.
It is an undeniable fact, putting all these parties together gives us a better opportunity to defeat the incumbent. Anything less is a dream that will never come true.
|
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
 |
|
|
dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2008 : 03:55:09
|
quote:
Originally posted by Nyarikangbanna
From another angle though, anybody who understands the impact of civic education and change of a generation, one will rightfully admit that the very people who are debating on these forums daily are a biproduct of a contineous civic education and campaign from PDOIS folks. Anyone who was in school in the late 80s to early 90s and until now will undeniably admit that they owe their political awareness largely due to these folks.- Dbaldeh
What a silly statement! I went to High School in about the mid 1990s and finished in the late 90s but I have always being dismissive of them and all what they stand for. As far as I am concern, all what they are renowned for is spinning and gross deception. They are too elitist and out of touch.
I am not a by-product of PDOIS. I have never been taught by them or attended any of their civic fora. I am also not a subscriber to their media outlet. I am a by-product of my parent's hard earned investment and scarifies. That is what I am. The only other people who can claim credit for my achievements are my uncle who housed and fed me for my entire High School duration, and the good teachers who taught me well and helped mould me to be what I am today.
Anyway, I hope somebody will produce imperial evidence to support this outlandish claim because if this claim is true, I believe their political following would have been greater than the decimal 3% they currently stand at. I think this statement is a manifestation of fanaticism gone too mad. I hope that the author will endeavour to explicitly exclude me from this delusional mischaracterisation sooner rather than later.
Thanks
It is just so difficult to intellectually argue with someone who sees nothing beyond himself. Your ego and self perfection dismally derail your intellectual ability to analyse and see things beyond hatred.
The biproduct of political education that I stated in my write up has strong historical facts to back up my analysis. I did not state anywhere that you as an individual is a biproduct of PDOIS. Am sure as soon as you saw PDOIS that was all you needed to respond without analysing the facts in my statements.
Let me make another attempt to explain not because I think you will get it this time, but because smart minded people will see the paralels in my explanation.
During the mid 80s and until this day, the folks at PDOIS are the only party that engaged in massive civic political education in the Gambia during and after elections. They are the only people who presented a different brand of politics in the Gambia which takes its roots from enlightenment first, political awareness second then choice of political decision third.
The party did this in so many ways, through their mouth piece Foroyaa, and through recorded tapes and meetings across the nation during and off political seasons. The younger generation that as I said were educated in the 80s & 90s at least for those who understand the value of education and give credit where due, will rightfully admit that the presence of PDOIS members in our political scene was simply different from all the Euphoria that used to surround PPP and NCP.
Another point, to butress my arguement, almost all political parties in the Gambia during the periods reference were a fracture of another party. NCP was a fraction of PPP, UPD a fraction of PPP/NCP/GPP. All those parties had something in common that is pretty much the same people served in the PPP except for few folks like Darboe who were brought to lead another spin up party.
All these parties literally only engage in active politics from election to election. All these parties rely on the old PPP doctrine of drumming and pretty much adopt the same political platform.
PDOIS on the other hand regardless of whether they win or not, were the first party to separate itself from the corrupt elites of the past regimes. They were and continue to be self funded and commit to massive education of the voters.
They are the first political party to have political organ a newspaper to educate the puplic, establish their own Nusery school and now primary school to educate Gambia children. They are no doubt the most respected individuals in the political arean in Gambia simply becuause of their principles.
I hope any fair minded reader who was around in mid 80s and early 90s and not in diapas will admit that folks like Sedia, Halifa, Sam Sarr and Amy Silla were a political intellectual brains to be reckon with.
"I am a by-product of my parent's hard earned investment and scarifies. That is what I am. The only other people who can claim credit for my achievements are my uncle who housed and fed me for my entire High School duration, and the good teachers who taught me well and helped mould me to be what I am today" Nyarikang
This quote above shows how narrow minded you think and how blinded you are to the rest of the world. This issue we are discussing is not an individual issue and it is not tide to anyone person. Because in personalize it and put yourself as the center of the issue, you could not understand that you owe as much to society as you do to your parents.
"I have never been taught by them or attended any of their civic fora. I am also not a subscriber to their media outlet".
This tells all about you. You have never attended their fora, or even listen to what they have to say because you simply hate anything other than what you are. I bet you never attended any other fora contrary to what you like or people you identify with.
As a student you would have been curious to attend some of the symposiums conducted by your very school that had Halifa or Sedia as the guest speaker. You would have listened to some of the debates they had on national radio or TV, but nop you are simply too KKK to see anything different.
This rejoinder you had completely exposes your whole self and I hope all the readers now know who they are dealing with, a human island who only sees and believes in himself period.
Question though: I wonder why you don't talk about Sedia Jatta who reportedly had close friendship with Darboe? Tell us your take on that as well...
|
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
|
|
|
kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2008 : 09:19:02
|
Nyari:
The question of electability was not the reason Darboe gave in his press release explaining his defection from NADD. In fact if I recall, Darboe was never very clear about his reason for leaving. The main reason he gave was that there was "lack of trust...".
The electability of Darboe or anyone for that matter was never presumed in the MOU. The MOU laid out a procedure for selecting the flagbearer.
Besides the question of electability may not afterall depend on Darboe (UDP)'s share of the electoral market, considering that UDP is a "restorationist" party drawing its livelihood mainly from the defunct PPP and NCP supporters.As a matter of fact, at the time of selecting the flagbearer many people considered Omar Jallow (O.J.) more electable than Darboe.
Darboe's insistence on being the flagbearer raises another question entirely. Considering the role set out for the flagbearer by the NADD MOU, that is retiring from politics completely after one five-year term, it looks like Darboe is not the one to honor that requirement. The flagbearer position appears to be suited for someone who is not so hungry for power. Darboe, by all indications will entrench himself as soon as he holds that power, just like Jawara and Jammeh. |
|
|
|
kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2008 : 15:39:40
|
Nyarikangbana A RUTHLESS SPIN DOCTOR & WEAK PROMOTER OF UDP! Your PERSONAL COMMENTS & RETHORICS AGAINST HALIFA & WAA JAWARA DOES NOT REPRESENT UDP VIEWS AND CONDITIONS!
Please refer me on UDP PRESS RELEASES OR ANY UDP POLITICAL ORGAN FOR INFORMATION, CAMPAIGNS & ANY DEVELOPMENTS ON GAMBIAN POLITICS AS PDOIS IS DOING THROUGH FOROYAA. On latest developments for Waa Juwara, the only RELIABLE SOURCE OF INFORMATION ON UDP'S REACTIONS CAME FROM DAILY OBSEVER; UDP and GPDP big wigs put the records straight under http://observer.gm/africa/article/2008/5/15/udp-and-gpdp-big-wigs-put-the-records-straight
The Point today I Did Not Defect to APRC - Waa Juwara under http://thepoint.gm/africa/gambia/article/2008/5/19/i-did-not-defect-to-aprc-waa-juwara
However would like to advise others to PLEASE IGNORE YOUR BOMBASTIC COMMENTS, SMEARING CAMPAIGN & POLITICS OF CONFRONTATION; e.g. "AYATOLLAH, ABD, MANSA etc etc BECAUSE OF ULTIMATELY SHOWING SIGNS OF SOBERNESS, MATURE POLITICS & STRATEGIES OBSERVED FROM THESE TACIT ENDORSEMENTS OF NYARINKANGBANA QUOTED BELOW:-
"It is an undeniable fact, putting all these parties together gives us a better opportunity to defeat the incumbent. Anything less is a dream that will never come true."
WAY FORWARD IS DIALOGUE WITHOUT PRE-CONDITIONS & NEGOTIATIONS!
|
Edited by - kobo on 19 May 2008 16:17:32 |
|
|
|
Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2008 : 19:34:35
|
http://thepoint.gm/africa/gambia/article/2008/5/19/i-did-not-defect-to-aprc-waa-juwara
Here it is: Juwara said he didn't deflect yet.
In the gypsies, before humans turn to the desired shape, they always go through transformations. I do not want to sound too hard on Juwara, matter of fact, he should be given the benefit of the doubt....but... |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
|
|
|
|
ebou4th
USA
106 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2008 : 19:56:46
|
It is unequivocal that both camps need each other to form a wining coalition. I made those comments to highlight Darboe's statue in Gambian politics today, the ABD allegation if true is very unfortunate and the ABD proponents are just kidding them selves. If there are true ABD proponents please come out and explain your reasons, as a student of Gambia politics I would love to know your reasons. If the goal is for Darboe to step aside do you think it is fair to ask the leader of the major opposition party to step aside for a leader of a minor opposition? If he wants to do this for the interest of the Gambia I will applaud him but I cannot see myself blaming him for what I would do if I were in his shoes.
You said "I have always argued that it is a political suicide to say without one party or one man, things will not work." It is rather unfortunate that one cannot apply this rule in the Gambia today. The blind loyalty brand of politics is very much alive in Gambia; it is going to take a long time to change this brand of politics. How do you think any coalition that lacks UDP or Darobe’s blessings can win?
Darboe is Gambia’s Hillary Clinton of the Democratic Party. He can make or break any coalition. The 2005 presidential election proved that without NAAD, UDP and NRP cannot win; while this is undeniable I think going by the statistics NAAD needs UDP and NRP more that UDP and NRP need NAAD.
The quickest path to a winning coalition is an agreement between both camps.
UDP/NRP coalition if based on the assumption that when you put together a coalition that comprises of the majority of the tribes in the Gambia is very unfortunate. All of us should stand against such brand of politics
I believe tribalism is a bankrupt idea that impedes progress, peace, innovation, and it fractures the fabric of society. The best and the brightest in society should lead regardless of what tribe he or she belongs to. Each and every one of us should sit with ourselves and ask this question; am I willing to back the best candidate for the job regardless of tribe? If and when this happens Gambia will head in the right direction.
Finally I would like to respectfully ask DBaldeh and Nayri not to hijack meaningful discussions by your rivalry.
|
“Revolutions are brought about by men, by men who think as men of action and act as men of thought.”
Kwame Nkrumah
|
|
|
|
kaanibaa
United Kingdom
1169 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2008 : 00:23:08
|
| Valid points in my opinion Ebou4th . problem though seems to be a lack of goodwill all round and that is a mighty wall to surmount , all things considered. Ideally one would see the way forward by a union of political parties which together can battle the incumbent party alas what we have is a divided opposition each deeply entrenched in their constituency ,ergo an impasse,and leaving every one gritting teeth and wishing for some miracle to happen.It is clear that neither side can go it alone , would reason prevail;bad as that they sound , my fear is that the answer is no for the moment. |
|
|
|
dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2008 : 01:10:23
|
quote:
Originally posted by ebou4th
You said "I have always argued that it is a political suicide to say without one party or one man, things will not work." It is rather unfortunate that one cannot apply this rule in the Gambia today. The blind loyalty brand of politics is very much alive in Gambia; it is going to take a long time to change this brand of politics. How do you think any coalition that lacks UDP or Darobe’s blessings can win?
Ebou4 be rest assured that I will not fall into personality discussion as far as Gambia's issues are concern. However, it is important to set the records straight that what we discuss here does not pertain to any single individual. It affects all of us as Gambians.
I think many people don't understand the real strategic position of the UDP politically. In fact contrary to many peoples' believes, UDP needs the smaller parties more than they need the UDP. From a logical arguement the largest party stands to lose more than the smaller parties when neither of them can't get to power because they can't come together.
If the largest party arguement has any merits, the UDP should be seen as the leader in mending fences and bringing the smaller guys to rally behind them. Strategically any sound minded party will cease this advantage and reach out to others.
Lack of sound leadership and a plan for winning strategy is what exist in the UDP and people close to the party will not admit this. Take the last two elections and see if you see any difference in the UDP approach to defeating Jammeh. It is the same optimism without concrete plans to win the hearts and minds of the voters. The party's strong holds like Badibu drifted away from them. Stronger candidates like Sainey Jaiteh quit the party to contest under the APRC. They contineously lose their supporters election after election.
So where is the winning strategy? I am with the arguement that if UDP claims to be the majority party, then they should take the leadership and solicit the support of the smaller parties. If they felt so strongly about not accepting anyone lead them, they should have done it diplomatically and openly NOT only advocate support from other parties but lay down concrete steps to win the support other opposition parties. This did not happen because the assumption was that they were entitle to the leadership and therefore no need to fight for it.
Just like what is happening to Clinton right now, she thought she was simply entitled to the nomination because of her husband's dynasty. In politics there is no entitlement. You have to fight for every vote and support from every angle. |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
|
|
|
kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
|
|
MADIBA
United Kingdom
1275 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2008 : 15:48:38
|
I would like to second Ebou on his plea for mawdo Demba and Nyari to exercise restraint in the discussion. I have said it before and i am going to say it again, apart from my conventional univeristy of brick and mortar this is my other university or virtual university. So please allow me to learn in a conducive environment. Lets be civic in our deliberations. Name calling, insults, should have no place here. In Pularr and i guess in many Gambian languages it is said, NO MATTER HOW LONG A LOG STAYS IN THE RIVER, IT NEVER CHANGES INTO A CROC. This is to say we may be living in the west, where it is ok, to tell someone irrespective of age that he lied. Back in our culture it is unacceptable. Am not saying one should know-tow, but use better wording. e.g I DISAGREE. or what you said is INCORRECT.
Peace. |
madiss |
|
|
|
kaanibaa
United Kingdom
1169 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 00:44:44
|
| I read the Senegambia news and if my memory serves me right i believe I read Juwara disputing his defection, as he said from where to where ? etc.Perhaps we are about to witness a new style of politics from Juwara's wing. You can never tell what these politicians have under their cloaks, do you remember Mark Anthony of Caesar fame? I do not think Juwara is a fool so now withdraw my previous observations regarding his defections huh hoo hum as the great 'Dibong' would sound. |
|
|
|
kaanibaa
United Kingdom
1169 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 17:24:30
|
Waa has fallen Long live Waa
Waa , the wrestler
Listen to the hustler
He claims you are fallen
Was the bout stolen
I really wonder
But like thunder
I hear your claim
Was it a lame blame
As for me I wait to see
If you are flea
Or a bee
Or worst still a butterfly
Who gives up after a feeble try
Do not leave us high and dry
Sending a torrent of cues
We want not excuse
To earn our respect
The truth is what we expect
The tide is on the flow
Your choice which way to follow
This is your call sir,Hello
Mbaa teetulo
Deedet teetumadeh
Ndagh dangaa ragal
Deedet ragalumadeh
Hee yough youghee
Deedet yough youghee wumadeh
Daanu wulow
Deedet daanuwumadeh
Kon nasaf nasaf
nasafa safa safa saff
|
|
|
|
dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 18:49:17
|
Madiba, be rest assured of my commitment to stay focus on the topics of discussion and not personal attacks. I will always strive to add to the substance of the debate and not derail it. Should I have no new stuff to add to any topic, then I will silently retire to another topic I can add value.
For me, the bantanta is like a social network where we learn and exchange ideas. I am fully committed to that and should any reader see me getting into a dead end on a topic, please do let me know and I will be happy to reverse course.
It is great to have the readers here draw our attention to the issues and not allow us to hijack the discussions. I will however not hesitate to confront anyone on the issues who is willing to personalize issues relating to Gambia and I hope we all do even if it is coming from me. I look forward to more feedback negative or positive on my contributions to the issues of discussion.
Thanks |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
|
|
|
ebou4th
USA
106 Posts |
Posted - 21 May 2008 : 20:22:05
|
DBaldeh, thanks for your understanding. You hit the nail on the head in your last reply; as far as I am concern the opposition camp needs a strong leader like Odinga of Kenya and Morgan Tsvangirai of Zimbabwe. I tried to highlight this problem with the opposition in my piece "Why did the people loose faith" http://gainako.com/fejango/Issue~190-2008/.
The political impasse in the Gambia is very serious and hopefully this time around the opposition camp addresses the leadership issue first.
Quick question 1. Do you think Darboe should give the helm to someone outside the existing political circle, if yes why?
Question. 2 Does anyone think if handled in a dignified and diplomatic manner Darboe will be willing to step aside?
|
“Revolutions are brought about by men, by men who think as men of action and act as men of thought.”
Kwame Nkrumah
|
|
|
|
dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 22 May 2008 : 04:54:52
|
Ebou, thanks for the response. To answer your question, I must first of all say it is easy to say Mr. X or Y should step down.
I honestly don't think Darboe should necessarily step down for someone outside. I think he deserves to lead just like any other opposition who have sacrificed so much in their personal lives for political gains in the gambia.
What we as Gambians expect from our leadership as you put it is someone who is really ready to fight tooth and nail with the Junta and gain the massive support of the Gambian people.
While Darboe has stood up to fight, some decisions he made during the 2006 Presidential and Parlimentary elections did not help boost the moral of his supporters. Case in point, while votes are still counted and his party militants were yet to report to him about the general outcome of the results, he conceded to Jammeh. Once you concede an election, you cannot turn around and despute the fairness of the process right?
Secondly, why contest the Presidential elections and boycotted the Parliamentary elections? This was a lapse in judgement in my judgement.
Third, for Darboe an exceptionally talented and successful lawyer to allow himself to signed off to the MOU of NADD knowing fully well what was at stake without fully understanding the implications on the leadership and only to come back later and shattered the hopes and dreams of thousands of Gambians, was also a lapse in leadership judgement.
Mr. Ebou4, these are not mere criticism of Darboe contrary to what UDP supporters will say but, an observation of a misjudgement of someone who is supposed to be a very strong leader. Such miscalculations can be costly and they have indeed cost Gambians dearly.
Finally to your last question, We need Darboe and any able Gambian to stay around and foster a stronger opposition. The issue should not be about one individual to stay or go, but rather a collective responsibility. Lets just suggest that Darboe stays he should be the one who mends fences and willing to negotiate with everybody.
Flexibility in leadership is not a weakness but rather a strength. Should Darboe realize that his leadership is impeding the progress of the political process, then Gambians should expect him to encourage others to take the lead.
So I must tell you something that you may or may not know, but left to Darboe alone there will not be a fight for leadership. I was personally among those who asked him about the leadership selection and about the NADD coalition sticking together when they visited the US in Seattle. He made an what many considered an honest and open commitment to rally behind anybody to make sure NADD stays united.
What I honestly think may have happened as I stated before here is that, there was a disconnect between the party leadership signing the MOU and the strong party supporters especially those in the U.S. Where there is a disconnect in any party, there is bound to be division.
We heard long since before UDP departed NADD that they were going to do so even while Darboe was assuring everyone that everything will be ok.
Ebou4, I think Darboe is a noble citizen, but the kind of situational leadership that is needed against Jammeh and his group, I wonder if Darboe is the one to fight the fight. He will fight in the courts and that is about it.
As the leader of the "major" opposition party in the Gambia, he need to come out and challenge Jammeh openly in the media. He need to be issuing press releases and counter Jammeh's challenges in the international community and call to action. Politics is not a seasonal thing. It is a full time job and when you are in it, you must be ready to give up your life for the rest of the populace.
What do you think? |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
| Bantaba in Cyberspace |
© 2005-2024 Nijii |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
