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kisley
United Kingdom
214 Posts |
 Posted - 24 May 2006 : 11:15:00
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| Thanks Njucks, much appreciated. |
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sab
United Kingdom
912 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2006 : 12:43:20
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Greetings Kisley, maybe take a look at http://home3.inet.tele.dk/mcamara that site is informative.
Whatever is that little computer brain doing wanting to know which tribe a person is from who passes you in the road unless it is a challenge? How many tribes in the Arsenal football team? Surely you don’t do that when visiting a hospital in UK, or ask the doctor? Please just forget it, you will probably find it far more interesting being a new visitor to the country to engage in conservation and find the difference in those brought up in the city to those brought up in the provinces. You will learn loads from it.
This forum a couple of weeks back had good links on one of the postings from Momodou, I am hard pushed for time, but maybe someone else can help to whereabouts it is!
regards, sab. |
The world would be a poorer place if it was peopled by children whose parents risked nothing in the cause of social justice, for fear of personal loss. (Joe Slovo - African revolutionary) |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2006 : 12:53:17
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quote:
Originally posted by kisley
Im always been told that I have typical "celtic" colouring, dark hair, very pale, green eyes - Its not being derogative.
Kisley, then we are two - I have been told the same, here and in UK. I, too, never saw this as derogative.
Connecting a certain personality (positive or negative), certain personal traits, abilities or deficits with people's appearance is what makes it problematic. The perception of the other becomes reduced, superfacial, making it possible to deny that the other person is a complex human being. |
Edited by - serenata on 24 May 2006 12:55:08 |
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admin
130 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2006 : 14:54:57
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Hi Sab, I just made a link correction in your posting (there is no www in the URL). The site you mentioned is the same as pressing "Home" at the top of this page and is a mirror site.
By the way the "search" link above is very useful if you want to find what has been posted here at the bantaba. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2006 : 23:52:34
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Thanks Njucks for handling Gambiabev's remarks!. Wanted to use the same appraoch and refer her where to get well researched sources of Gambian history, anthroplogy, tourism and culture to gather enough reliable information.
This topic about immigration issues is so useful and important to us that we should not allow it to be messed up with other incompatible issues. |
Edited by - kobo on 25 May 2006 00:01:11 |
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sab
United Kingdom
912 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 00:43:06
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Thanks Admin, I need some magic water, I'm still looking for the links I was on last week!
sab. |
The world would be a poorer place if it was peopled by children whose parents risked nothing in the cause of social justice, for fear of personal loss. (Joe Slovo - African revolutionary) |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 01:25:25
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Gambianbev guide is he for real? In this day and age people still have such negative thinking. So if in a Europe a blonde must automatically be from Germany, a redhead from Ireland, black hair from Spain, mousy blonde from Holland. Or isn't it possible for them all to be members of the same family born of the same mother and father? It's sometime good to engage the brain before typing on the keyboard.
Peace
Sister Omega |
Peace
Sister Omega |
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BornAfrican
United Kingdom
119 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 01:32:33
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Originally posted by serenata
Prejudices always come as individual views; that's what makes them dangerous. And, to be frank: I heard people in Gambia - Mandinka, Wolof - talk bad about the Jolas. The reason was mostly that some Jolas are animists ("Hey, these people are praying to stones and trees - I mean...!!") and that some of them drink alcohol.
BornAfrican:
Serenata, i do not want to talk about any particular tribe. i am a black man and an AFrican. I belong to the African tribe. You see when the ARabs and the christian missionaries migrated to Africa, the first thing they did was to impose themselves on us and be our superiors. thus, they told us about the god they have and that he is greater than the African god(s). they branded our cultures and rituals as evil(thereby branding ourselves evil). africans who refused to embrace these "superior" religions were opressed, supressed and slain by their own kinsmen. unfortunately, the same saga continues today. those who a very cultured and put their cultures before anything are often discriminated. Jolas have never been conquered by the christian and muslim crusaders who invaded our part of Africa.
not to forget, this thread is all about immigration issues. kondorong made a remark that i did like, and it goes"The problem is the black race has decided that they will be CONSUMERS OF CIVILISATION."
i think even if some Africans want to be partners of even producers in world's economic arena, its going to be very difficult. for most africans, there is no existing infrastructure on which theey could build. this forces most of us to go our just to get that economic "big bang", come home and be producers in our own communities. we have seen a lot of it in the Gambia. most of Gambian born business men have gotten their initial capitals from outside. Europe and America knows this. immigrants are like commodities. they come in and go out. they are always on the move and this translates into a vibrant economies for those countries that open their borders to them(immigrants). i think keeping out AFrican immigrants is even diminishing that hope of finding the initial "economic springboard" which will atleast enable them to get to that "middle class" level which is not existing in subsaharan african countries. the ultimate truth is that no one is entirely self-sufficient. During that part of the year that he takes his holiday, Tony Blair can't get the sun he wants in Europe, he has to migrate to the carribeans for some time. |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 08:46:33
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Sister Omega thanks for pointing that out. '' i thought all blondes are Swedish''  . you see how wrong we can be when we generalise and make '' sweeping statements''
BornAfrican. Civilisation is not necessarily continuous. it can be distinct and can move from one place to another leaving its influence. Religion came to Africa just like it came to Eurpoe, Asia and the Americas. As it spread in Europe,Africa,Asia, South America both islam and christianity have killed a lot of people. even trying to be a different christian (protestant) to Catholism made many non-believers in old Europe and they were killed. the Spanish Inquisition was endorsed by the Church and you can even call it a genocide. the Soninke-Marabout wars in the Senegambia were also 'Jihad' but also about political power.
it is not just Jolas that resisted Islam. But Mandinkas too. you only have to learn about the History of Kaabu (i dont think Janke Walli or Kelefa Sanneh were muslims) to know this. in northern Senegal (Saloum) many wollof were also not muslims untill recently. Latdior was a convert. that is why the word cheddo is very common in our history.
in the end Africa like all places had its politics. it has never being ''pure'' and isolated never in its history. this is often a common mistake. |
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kisley
United Kingdom
214 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 10:32:18
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quote:
So if in a Europe a blonde must automatically be from Germany, a redhead from Ireland, black hair from Spain, mousy blonde from Holland. Or isn't it possible for them all to be members of the same family born of the same mother and father? It's sometime good to engage the brain before typing on the keyboard.
[/quote]
Sister Omega where in my comment did I say the above. Its not good to take peoples words out of context. Sorry that I am not as well read as yourself, but i didnt learn to read and write until i was in my 20s - but at least Im trying. If some one is wrong then explain why they are wrong or being ignorant, stop trying to make people look small - thats certainly not clever. Is it ok to say a person from Gambia is USUALLY black - or is that for some reason negative stereotyping - I give up.
Bye everyone, and thanks to those who tried to help me with links and good answers. . |
Edited by - kisley on 25 May 2006 11:44:21 |
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jambo
3300 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 11:52:00
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Kisley are you leaving,  take time out but stay in touch, Bantaba is a great place for giving and receiving information. hate to loose you |
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 12:41:43
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Kisley instead of running away why not develop your argument? It is obvious from my statement you are offended by the stereotyping of the European race. The point I was making is the same applies when the shoe is on the other foot when describing other races but in particularly the African race. The classification system was first devised in the 18th century with race horses and then transferred to classify Africans for the breeding programs on slave plantations in the America's, under the slave system such practices were justified because Africans were seen as subhuman. A horse was valued more than an African life,as ludicrus as this sounds today this was the thinking amongst most Europeans then and ensrined in laws.
The problem which keeps on arising when people make what they believe are innnocent comments here on the forum, which I believe when gambiabev made her initial contribution, she was unaware of its negative connotations. That's because she was unaware of the roots of their negative impacts. Because racism is a false construct staunched in stereotypes based on ignorance greed and power. If I were to give you the example of Nazi Germany where Hitler experiment to make a pure Arian race where white blonde and blue eyes was put on the pedal stool as being the most superior human being on the planet we can see how ludicrus this seems today,especially when Jesse Owens blew this myth away at the Olympic games in 1936, and Hitler had to leave the stadium in embrassment.
On another level there are national and ethnic characteristics that describe people but in the modern world where there are a lot of mixtures between different ethnic groups across national and international borders it is increasingly becoming more difficult to classify people on tribal grounds hence the colour hair analogy.
Peace
Sister Omega |
Peace
Sister Omega |
Edited by - Sister Omega on 25 May 2006 12:43:53 |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 16:42:28
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Sister Omega you are VERY PATRONISING!
It is not true that ALL blondes are Swedish...it IS true that MOST swedish people are blonde. 
Usually, stereotypes and generalisations have SOME element of truth to them.
I would like to ask a Jola person, what characteristics of Jolas sets them apart from the rest of Gambian people. What are they proud of in being a Jola? What makes them different from other groups?
Or are all Gambian groups exactly the same as each other? |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 25 May 2006 : 17:23:45
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quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
I would like to ask a Jola person, what characteristics of Jolas sets them apart from the rest of Gambian people. What are they proud of in being a Jola? What makes them different from other groups?
Or are all Gambian groups exactly the same as each other?
Like all people in the World, what makes them different is their Language, Food, Culture, Traditionals, Dance, Music, Clothes/Dress, Names. |
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