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jambo
3300 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 13:31:07
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| nice point karamba, but i do believe african should help other africans, some situation in africa are down to pure bloody mindlessness, attitude and laziness. as you say if you and I agree that is a big step, but how many are there that are like you and i, against the others who are self, self, self. |
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bread man
300 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 14:49:44
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| Just make the comparison between 400years of colonial rule, 30years of sir Dawda and 12years of Jammeh. If you are realistic you will see that your critisms has no justification. Jammeh is not a magician but a hard worker with visions for development. He just won the election by over 60%. If you think that 60% of the Gambians living in The Gambia are sleeping thats why they voted for him, then you really need a reality check. We have seen what his government is doing and that fits us Gambian living in The Gambia. So please be objective in your critisms. |
It is the mark of intelligence to entertain an idea without accepting it. |
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Cornelius
Sweden
1051 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 14:59:43
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Dear Bantaba discussants ,
People born in Freetown, Sierra Leone, love freedom. Especially of speech and movement . Ask anyone of us. Wives cannot control us and some are masters of MUTA ( nothing to do with bribery….muta means to bribe in Swedish)
Here we are being personable and sociable, that is all and not armed at all.
N.B: The price of land will only go up – whether in SerraKunda or Ramallah!
We are free to and usually do ignore matters that do not concern us and that we are not interested in. I am here and writing, because I am interested. Not because I’m idle. I am never idle. And I am not in competition with anybody – not even for a high position in heaven.
About my alleged misuse of the English language, I did have the best A level results ina West Africa ( conducted by the University of London in English Literature – not in German) Blessings on Professor Bankole Thompson and Michael Brunson! And I do have an honours degree in English ( and philosophy) from the University of Durham from June 1969) which does not mean that I do not have a great respect for the infinite resources of the English language. To also plunder and exploit it. Not like Soyinka or the Archbishop of Canterbury ( Ramsey) ( who was a classmate of my first father-in-law - and conducted the wedding of my first wife , but like a Buccaneer, Morgan the Pirate or Wild Bill Hickock ) – if need be. By all means necessary is the motto – and no – to re-colonisation. It pains me to have had to speak of such ancient things that are really of not much significance to me ( or you) when I think of how much I’ve travelled since those teenage days….. when my wife already had a Masters in Modern Languages, from Stockholm University with distinctions in everything.) Air cleared of relative and comparative linguistic freedoms, lets move on – and Ahhhhhhhh – how I wish that there was REAL freedom of language and speech !!!!! Bullets, only bark……like James Baker…..not Madiba…..
To begin with, I would say that it is the duty of any Government to keep their promises to their people – to deliver in the areas of public health, education, agriculture, housing, employment, social and cultural and musical advancement which keeps everybody engaged at some appropriate level – in contributing to the development and sustenance of the country, community or society in which we live – and also the strengthening and development of democratic institutions- not only the army but also the rule of law, the Judiciary, the police and policing, improving on Human Rights, a free press and the enhancement of the freedom and privileges of all the individuals who make up our populaces, so that in every national the feeling grows that “ I am proud to be a Gambian” and protected within the Gambia and also without ( that’s good foreign policy) – so that if a Gambian gets killed and is dumped in a dustbin in Sweden, the Gambian government screams – and is able to scream.
http://www.irinnews.org/report.asp?ReportID=54471&SelectRegion=West_Africa&SelectCountry=GAMBIA
http://allafrica.com/stories/200303240608.html
http://www.thecommonwealth.org/Internal/39079/141116/39180/the_gambia/
Unfortunately at this stage of the Gambia’s development, democracy is essentially equated with merely having a free and fair election, winner takes all/ “majority“ wears the crown and the rest ? The World can “ go to hell” ? Ahmadinejad didn’t say that.
Democracy or even crazy demo, is much more than merely winning an election ( even under the benign supervision of Nigeria’s ex-military man turned president, General Abdul Salaam Abu Bakarr, and in the interest of strengthening the possibility of multi-party democracy and helping the often weak and disadvantaged opposition (“in a country where even the Radio and Television Service is so tightly (though denied) controlled by government “) I have previously posted the IDEA website, which both pro-government and opposition activists ( and farmers) can subscribe to:
http://www.idea.int/
In this information society ( that is Sweden for example) you are all at liberty to ignore the links. I go out of my way ( valuable time) to provide them as information links – and that’s what our community suffers from most – not just a lack of education, but even access to very basic, very elementary information – even information about what some of our African governments are doing – without even consulting the people. We vote for them and then cannot tell them what to do, and some of us they ride like donkeys. Is there no access to information Act? Auditing and Accounting? ( Santanfara could apply for the job of keeping an eye on the local government spending.)
According to the BBC :"Gambians vote with their marbles"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/5369966.stm
"Gambians use marbles to vote in presidential elections"
http://news.monstersandcritics.com/africa/article_1203950.php/Gambians_use_marbles_to_vote_in_presidential_elections
I do agree with Karamba that it is our duty and especially the duty of the intelligentsia (especially of the Diaspora, who do not live under the constraints of intimidation and fear of repercussions on their families etc) to “Tell society what you think and your position in this game of folly.”- although I have my reservations about thus naming our present situation, as “ this game of folly”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/5365256.stm
It would seem clear to all of us that from July 23 1994 (a) President Jammeh is no fool - that would be an insult to the collective intelligence quota of the Gambian masses, and having said that there is no gainsaying that we (the people) - still at the stage of counting marbles - get the leader and government that we deserve.
As has been pointed out by all who have contributed so far on this topic and this is also confirmed by the Quran in which we are to assume that most Gambians believe, that God does not change a people until or unless they want to change themselves.
AS Jambo says, “Gambians have to change”
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&rls=GGLJ%2CGGLJ%3A2006-51%2CGGLJ%3Aen&q=%22Allah+Will+Not+Change+the+Condition+of+a+People%22&btnG=Search&meta=
Education as to their/our civil liberties and responsibilities is very much the answer – and this can only be achieved in an environment under the rule of law.
Fela says “ A fool at forty is a fool forever – nah so di bukpipul dem say
Ah noh go tell me brodha like that
Fool nah fool no matter foh age etc etc… “
There’s much to learn from the life and lyrics of Fela Anikulapo Kuti …check him out under MUSIC
About Touchstone or “fool”:
http://etext.virginia.edu/cgi-local/DHI/dhi.cgi?id=dv4-70
Pick it up from here……I’m not feeling too well……
Later Ali G……….
Ali G wanted to join the army and for qualifications he asked “ Does it help that I’ve killed somebody?”
What’s that you say?
No, I have never wanted to be a president either….
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Edited by - Cornelius on 18 Dec 2006 15:36:00 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 16:53:16
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Good Fellows,
Take no offence we have to possess our freedom to express, not simply call it freedom of expression. Please, please,please read Cornelius. There is a bank of wisdom to tap from.
The task is not to unseat Jammeh. It is for peopel to gain a more progressive culture of socialisation and positive dialogue. Do not be loyal to Jammeh but to the ideals of a better society. Even if Jammeh stands for that, it is not enough to make him the STATE. The Gambia is not Jammeh and Jammeh is not big enough to be called The Gambia. It was this politics of personalities that kept us this low and will continue doing so. Move on. We are not Jammeh haters but still love Gambia more. |
Karamba |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 17:56:16
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quote:
Originally posted by bread man
Just make the comparison between 400years of colonial rule, 30years of sir Dawda and 12years of Jammeh. If you are realistic you will see that your critisms has no justification. Jammeh is not a magician but a hard worker with visions for development. He just won the election by over 60%. If you think that 60% of the Gambians living in The Gambia are sleeping thats why they voted for him, then you really need a reality check. We have seen what his government is doing and that fits us Gambian living in The Gambia. So please be objective in your critisms.
point of correction. Colonial rule lasted nearly 155 years from 1815 to 1970. |
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MADIBA
United Kingdom
1275 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 18:03:09
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point of correction. Colonial rule lasted nearly 155 years from 1815 to 1970.
Konds, any reference(s) for the specific period? Just curious |
madiss |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 18:22:40
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quote:
Originally posted by MADIBA
point of correction. Colonial rule lasted nearly 155 years from 1815 to 1970.
Konds, any reference(s) for the specific period? Just curious
Can you be more explicit. |
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MADIBA
United Kingdom
1275 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 21:59:56
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quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
quote:
Originally posted by MADIBA
point of correction. Colonial rule lasted nearly 155 years from 1815 to 1970.
Konds, any reference(s) for the specific period? Just curious
Can you be more explicit.
Konds i can't write sarahule I wrote English. What i want is an online link(s) for mre details on this historical fact if available. I told you here before that am passionate about history. So A NYA NGA MO please assist. sorry for coming back late. |
madiss |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 22:36:43
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You are funny Madiba.
You see i am not smart enough to decode and you must be very direct when dealing with me.
AN TOHO?
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 22:40:48
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| Corn..how old are you? If you got a degree from an english university in 1969 you must be nearing retirement?! I was born in 1960! Did you actually study in Durham or was it by post? |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2006 : 22:50:09
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quote:
Originally posted by gambiabev
Corn..how old are you? If you got a degree from an english university in 1969 you must be nearing retirement?! I was born in 1960! Did you actually study in Durham or was it by post?
I went to Cardiff and proud of my university.
Who told you I am nearing retirement. Is it another Yankuba asking sheriff to open his mouth so we could count his teeth to ascertain his age? |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2006 : 10:17:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Karamba
Good Fellows,
Take no offence we have to possess our freedom to express, not simply call it freedom of expression. Please, please,please read Cornelius. There is a bank of wisdom to tap from.
The task is not to unseat Jammeh. It is for peopel to gain a more progressive culture of socialisation and positive dialogue. Do not be loyal to Jammeh but to the ideals of a better society. Even if Jammeh stands for that, it is not enough to make him the STATE. The Gambia is not Jammeh and Jammeh is not big enough to be called The Gambia. It was this politics of personalities that kept us this low and will continue doing so. Move on. We are not Jammeh haters but still love Gambia more.
Thanks Karamba and the likes of dBaldeh, Kondorong and Dalton for your vibrant intellectual discussions, logical analysis, resourceful contributions and critical thinkers. I am very impressed with the quotes above amongst your posts and do hope that it would make us understand that Jammeh does not own "patriotism, progressive african(s), the nice sweets and cream of OUR MOTHERLAND; FOR THE GAMBIA OUR HOMELAND"
Others felt that any critical comments or negative comments should not be discussed. Am not bothered about Jammeh but that not evrything is o.k at home (GAMBAIA) politically vis-a vis our socio-economic development. THE FEAR FACTOR IS A REALITY, AUTHORITARIAN RULE UNDER A WEAK DEMOCRATIC STATE.
Under this topic "jammeh and gambians, who fools who?". jambo my advised to you is that Gambians are no fools but Jammeh presently gained the upper hand to GOVERN, DICTATE AND INSTITUTE for e.g The Independent Electoral Council (IEC) appears not INDEPEDENT!
"LET JUSTICE GUIDE OUR ACTIONS TOWARDS THE COMMON GOOD!
AND
JOIN OUR DIVERSE PEOPLES TO PROOF MANS' BROTHERHOOD!
PEACE.
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2006 : 10:44:36
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Kobo,
Your message is sound and clear. The one big reason why some people are making Jammeh an issue is because they do not want the rest of society to see light. If it takes every Gambian each day to read and digest our National Anthem, then we get closer and closer to rediscovering our nationhood. Kobo, be there to challenge anybody with whatever flowery words they produce, who wants us to keep our eyes off The Gambia and to see Yahya Jammeh as the state. No professor, singer, student, communist, beggar, or computer engineer is able to transform an individual into a state. In real fact, the likes of Jammeh are nowhere near what seasoned scholars will call revolutionaries. What happened on 22 July 1994 is not and can never be a revolution. Anyone is free to call yours by the name you choose. If Jammeh and his lot choose to call theirs July 22 revolution, it is all freedom of expression. That does not mean serious thinkers like you have to accept that. Behind closed doors, the soldier/ministers in Jammeh's government and rest of the official wing in the administration know better that this state of affairs is not sustainable. |
Karamba |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2006 : 11:03:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Karamba
Kobo,
Your message is sound and clear. The one big reason why some people are making Jammeh an issue is because they do not want the rest of society to see light. If it takes every Gambian each day to read and digest our National Anthem, then we get closer and closer to rediscovering our nationhood. Kobo, be there to challenge anybody with whatever flowery words they produce, who wants us to keep our eyes off The Gambia and to see Yahya Jammeh as the state. No professor, singer, student, communist, beggar, or computer engineer is able to transform an individual into a state. In real fact, the likes of Jammeh are nowhere near what seasoned scholars will call revolutionaries. What happened on 22 July 1994 is not and can never be a revolution. Anyone is free to call yours by the name you choose. If Jammeh and his lot choose to call theirs July 22 revolution, it is all freedom of expression. That does not mean serious thinkers like you have to accept that. Behind closed doors, the soldier/ministers in Jammeh's government and rest of the official wing in the administration know better that this state of affairs is not sustainable.
On that fateful day the advocacy and declarations levied against a democratically elected regime under P.P.P and former President Jawara were on these resounding words; "CORRUPTION! ACCOUNTABILITY! TRANSPARENCY!
They even coined in "dirimocracy!" as typical of Jawara's government instead of a "democracy!".
Democracy varies from counry to country and the word very easy to use to gloss a political climate for a given society.
Courtesy of Kiwi01 and Cornelius from world politics forum; Topic : A pause in democracy's march, pasted below are relevant and useful information for studies. Thanks brother Cornelius!
"How Democracy is defined and measured for this study…..
http://www.economist.com/media/pdf/DEMOCRACY_INDEX_2007_v3.pdf "
There are certain reservations and complexities under the indexes above as diverse issues and factors interacts etc. However Gambian democracy accomodates FEAR, ARBITARY ARRESTS AND DETENTIONS, TERROR, BULLY, HARASSMAENT AND POLITICAL VICTIMASATIONS. Where are we with DEMOCRACY as Gambians? Or What is Gambian democracy with the crucial role of the IEC and the electorate to exercise their political will?
Furthermore Karamba and my fellow compatriots! Am declaring here that: OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM IS MORE THAN OUR (GAMBIA) CONSTITUTION IN-DEPTH TO INVOKE JUSTICE, EQUITY, DIVERSITY AND INSPIRE PEACE, PROSPERITY, PROGRESS AND STABILTY FOR THE GAMBIA OUR HOMELAND!
The Gambia National Anthem
Sing along! http://resourcepage.gambia.dk/anthem.htm
"LET JUSTICE GUIDE OUR ACTIONS TOWARDS THE COMMON GOOD!" |
Edited by - kobo on 19 Dec 2006 11:34:44 |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2006 : 12:27:27
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Kobo,
Nationality above personality. State above president etc. Behind the noisy confusion lies the motive to rob us when our attention is diverted. Now onwards, we must make it our national resolve to advance this move. When each member of wider society gets to recognise what the nation means to all, the deceptive club of whatever form and name will run out of air. If you start it today by December 2007, you alone could win over board a strong 365 enlightened Gambians ready to liberate others in the days, weeks, months, and years to come. We tend to feel like it is about calling crowds in the name of an organisation. The establishment is prepared to crush organisations they see by number counts. But when the idea of liberation filters down into society, there is no tool to measure how this impacts over a period in time. Get one person onboard today and by December 2007, you have 365 sound minds thinking like you. How great that is !!! "One, one coco, full a basket."-B Marley |
Karamba |
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