| Author |
 Topic  |
|
ganbi
United Kingdom
20 Posts |
 Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 00:10:38
|
Hi kondorong, thanks for your piece it is very enlightening, however my history about jangjangbureh contradicts yours. As I understand the people who first settled in the island were siblings from mali and their names where Jangjang and Bureh although their surname was not confirmed as some say they were Sidibeh others say they were Sankareh and so on. There is even a cemetary in the island with the inscription of the two names. Correct me if am wrong because you seem to know lot of stuff about niani.
SALAM.
|
 |
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 00:15:49
|
| I do not know anything. oral history is as consistent as its inconsistencies. i have heard stories like yours. I do not know what to believe but atleast we are able to know from all angles. Keep your contirbutions flowing. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
Edited by - kondorong on 14 Mar 2006 00:26:06 |
|
|
|
Solution
29 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 10:38:54
|
Am not trying to be funny but why occupying time on this issue of Sir Dawda's faith. I respect every one's opinion but I think that as Gambians, we have other relevant issues to talk about rather than the faith of a person who considerably contributed to the mess the Gambia
is in today.
Accept my apology if you consider this comment in appropiate. |
|
|
|
makang
4 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 12:13:13
|
| jangjang and bureh were sliblings correct but their surname was jorbarteh and not sidibeh as they are stil found(their decendants) around niani primarily in villages like kayai and so on...the sidibeh dinasty from marcathy are also one of the earliest settlers but are not direct decendants of janjang and bureh may be through family intermarriage.their original settle still called jangjang bureh is still there and not marcathy as is believed by many people this old village is still inhabitted maily today by fulas as the family have move on to settle in kayai . |
|
|
|
makang
4 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 12:17:46
|
| Sir dawda has converted to christianity as the story goes and was converted back by a famous marabou from kayai who later was married with one of his sisters,but it could also be that he has merely change his name because dawda is the same as david which then was read as converting to christianity? |
|
|
|
Nyancho
Switzerland
22 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 17:06:41
|
| But Makang,is Dawda, Jawaras given name at birth?Was Sheikou not the name he was christened with?Am just being curious:I understood that during the colonial era,only christians were allowed in certain schools and or the children/relatives(mostly male) of Chiefs,could that have also probably influence Jawaras decisions at the time to embrace christianity? |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 18:50:11
|
Solution
I do not think it is a waste of time talking about Jawar's faith. He held public office and as such he has become part of our history just the same way yaya has become. We may not like Jawara or Yaya but we cannot erase them from our history and we need to find the time to deal with it because they will never go away.
That is why we have to guard who we elect as our leaders becasue they reflect on us as a nation, and they make decisions in our name irrespective of whether we voted for them or not. |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
|
|
|
Janyanfara
Tanzania
1350 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2006 : 22:39:49
|
Well friends,
I know Janjan & Bury were siblings but as alleged by some that they were either Sidebeh of mambury or any other surname,Anyway history is subjected to somany researches and I am still digesting all am getting on this as my book will also include Janjanbury.
When I was in Georgetown last year,I gathered from very prominent elderly Citizens of Janjan-Bury that Janjan& Bury were Jawo(Banna) from Sankuley kunda.They used to cross the bolong(linking Georgetown/Sankuley kunda) to farm rice.Thereby deciding to settle down thare and people who want to see them would say " lets go to janjan-buray...thus the name janjanburay.
As 4 Dawda Jawara,History will surely be his judge if he was a bad leader or not.His name was Dawda at christening but as some of my friends rightly said,he was turned a christiansed by father flemmings as in those days most childreen going to christian schools were given christian names eg like Hassan Musa Camara(Andrew Camara), Micheal Baldeh, Hendry Jammeh Churchils Baldeh ect when they were sent to the missionary built by British missionery Mr.Fraiser near Jawo kunda in Kantora District URD.
Sons of chiefs and prominent people were sent to Armitage then But the First educated people were not really sons of chiefs as then people were not keen on sending their sons to the whiteman's school.
Mankajang Janyanfara |
|
|
|
makang
4 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2006 : 11:58:22
|
I think its more a question of name than of faith,they understood the situation that they were in.I personally do not believe that he change religion i could be wrong though,but i can see how it can be interpreted like that.As you rightfully pointed out janjang,is only those people that were christians that get to be in postions of any importance,so many of them might thought that changing ones name wouldnt matter so much,but it did matter anyway with ,as such things were not the norm in those days.I believe that they have proved to be devout muslims over the years which would have been difficult for anyone who change his religion and then change it back.
AS for the story concerning janjang and bureh,you are right to point out that there are conflicting reports as the history is only oral,but next time you are in gambia pleas try to visit KAYAI as am sure you will be able to find some important information.I applaud your efforts to document the history,and i assure you that you will still find people around niani that would be able to give you a chronological order of things...you can start in lamenkoto i believe ther live an old woman ther called Nanno she is an expert in the history of niani.In the event that she cant answer some quetions she would tell you who can.In serre kunda you can also talk to banna kanutehs family,he is not alive anymore unfortunately but his wife might be able to give you some useful information on the subject. |
|
|
|
Janyanfara
Tanzania
1350 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2006 : 12:43:40
|
Mankang,
Oh thank you so much.These are the kind if information I need as any book thatcomes 4 Gambia should be based on AFrican narration verified by African.
I shall surely go to Lamenkoto.
|
|
|
|
Biraago
Gambia
173 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2006 : 15:14:29
|
Kondorong
quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
INFACT KAOLACK WAS SAID TO BE PART OF GAMBIA. THIS IS ONE OF THE REASONS OF THE STRONG RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE FAMILIES OF THE NIASSE AND THE GAMBIAN PEOPLE. INFACT WHEN TYSON (SENEGALESE BOXER) FOUGHT FOR THE CHAMPIONSHIP, HE HAD MORE SUPPORT IN THE GAMBIA. BEACUSE THAT PART OF SENEGAL WAS TRADITIONALLY GAMBIA AND HENCE VERY SYPATHETIC TO THE GAMBIAN CAUSE.
You have some intresting facts but needs to be revisited.
Gambia and Senegal are recent history and the creation of the colonial masters. We should not take them too much into our hearts, rather we should the global African picture.
Before 1884, the Berlin Cenfrence were the Europen colonialist carved up our continent into new nation states, there existed the ever shifting boundaries (through wars of conquest) of the small kingdoms lead by the different African leaders as we know in our own history.
The Niasse are from the extended family of Buur ba Jolof through Jaila Niaase (a lady descendand of the king), most of these religious families are inte-related by family ties. Alhaji Malich Sy if a first cousin to Sheikh Ahmadou Bamba through his mother's side.
Alhaji Malick's teacher, name sake and uncle Malick Sowe was of the family that had always been the Imams of Gede in Fuuta Tooro Senegal and they have descendants in the Gambia still. Like Alhaji Hassan Njie of Radio Gambia whose mother is a descendant of Malick Sowe, Imam Omar Sowe, Fodiga Sowe etc. On his father's side, they are the descendants of Albury Njie Buur ba Jolof.
Hama Bah or Maba Jahou Bah gathered Mam Moor Anta Sally, the uncle of Ahmadou Bamba and his father , the father of Alhaji Abdoulie Niasse Muhammadou Niasse among the other leaders of the Islamic resistance movement against the french and they transfered to Saloum for regroupment when the war was being tough on Alhaji Umar Taal because he had spread his army too wide into West Africa caused by the propagation of Islam.
Alhaji Abdoulaye Niasse fought alongside Maba Jahou and later Sayer Maty Bah the son of Maba and they were refugees in the Gambia together.
Alhaji Abdoulaye Niasse returned to Senegal but was to be captured by the French in corperation with some Senegalese capitulants and this forces him to return to the Gambia again as a refugee (Kerr Samba Yassin and Banjul).
This is just a summary.
You have a wide intrest in history.
As one of the contributors said, you should ask Momodou to create a special history subject.
Take care. |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2006 : 18:36:40
|
Biraago
Actually i was responding to the issues raised by Momodou regarding Niani and its boundaries. Niani existed even before the Berlin Conference. I had to use present day towns and geograhical realities so that readers can bring the issue into perspective. Niani was a Kingdom that existed and flourished years before contact with the west.
It is a winding story.This explains why the Niasse have a large following in Banjul. These religious families have always married outside their immediate family circles and i am not surprised that they are inter-related.
I was told that Sheikh Ibra Faal is actually Ebrima Fatty from the Guinea Bissau region and most likely from Manna Jamang in Kaabu. That he was a student of the Mbacke but for some reasons the last name changed to Faal which to most people is the same as Fatty. Can you help on this matter |
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.” |
Edited by - kondorong on 10 Aug 2006 01:40:26 |
|
|
|
MADIBA
United Kingdom
1275 Posts |
Posted - 17 Mar 2006 : 12:51:50
|
I want to thank all for this positive forum. I am not a historian but am quite interested in it. Alot has been said about certain places and people but attimes the versions are far apart. Regarding Jangjanbureh I heard a Alh. Sait Camara of Banjul on Sud-FM radio sometime last on his programme CHOSSAN NI SENEGAMBIA(history of the senegambia) that initial inhabitants of Jangjanbureh are indeed the Jawos. I have also heard that Gambia actually stopped at the Bridge before Kaolack where the Customs post is. I think the bridge is called PONTE NOIRE(black bridge in French). The same Alh. Sait Camara a historian said that Maba Bah was related to Sundiata Keita of the Mali empire. Kondorong when next you go to Gambia please check out this Alh. Sait Camara in Tobacco Road.
I have few questions which have been pestering me for awhile?
1. Is it true that Sering Touba' real surname is Bah
2. That the equivalent of the NJIE is JATTA, BOJANG is CONTEH? |
madiss |
|
|
|
njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 18 Mar 2006 : 02:53:07
|
hi Madiba
regarding serign Touba , i remember seeing a similar question at the forum at seneweb.com/ sadly it ended up as a very heated debate. i am not sure how widespread the surname Mbacke is, but it is this surname that all his sons have used and is generally accepted. but some sources also use Bah.see
http://www.teranga-senegal.com/senegal/religions.html
if i may respectfully point out a slight error in Biraago's text who has given us a good insight into these religious families, his father was Morr Anta Saly and his mother Mam Jara Busso.
i'm not sure njie is the same as jatta, but when I was in Mali, Njie there is equated to Jarra and Trawally to Jobe.
chiekh ibra faal was born in senegal so i dont think he was from Kaabu, he was devoted to amadou bamba and helped recruit followers promoting a strong work ethic as well. Fatty atleast what i know is usually associated with hydera not faal.
surnames take different forms just like a topic on Sir Dawda can end up on Amadou Bamba  , but the important thing is that it shows us that we are all one.
i hope this helps
|
|
|
|
MADIBA
United Kingdom
1275 Posts |
Posted - 18 Mar 2006 : 10:57:10
|
Thanks njucks. Some of the narrators said that Sering touba was a cousin to Mawdo Malick Sy. Mawdo Malick sy has both parents as toucoulor(fulas from northern senegal). Anyway what is gratifying is that we are all bonded at certain points.i will visit the link you posted.
|
madiss |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
Topic Locked
