 |
|
| Author |
 Topic  |
|
blackerberry2004
69 Posts |
 Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 14:48:12
|
Yeah, I watched that concession conversation (Jammeh had Darboe on speaker with TV cameras rollng). I was really disappointed with Darboe. Maybe he was threatened to concede (that was what my unofficial source said). I was bewildered to hear Jammeh said "I am your Daddy" or "You are my son" (not quite sure what the exact phrase was). I chalked it up to a "kall" thing.
Darboe is quite inconsistent and has dictatorial tendencies. He changes positions frequently and does make unilateral decisions quite frequently and that is worrisome to me.
How come he boycotted the National Assembly elections (thereby giving the APRC carte blanc)for lack of fair play yet we all know that things have gotten worse since 2002 and he is vying for the presidency tooth and nail? Could it be that he was not to contest the NA elections and so he could boycott it? It would only affect the then would-be aspirants for parliament and not him. |
 |
|
|
OB1
84 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 16:02:27
|
| It has made no sense for Darboe to have boycotted the NA elections, unilaterally. If UDP had stood for them, the house would have been SPLIT, and it would have (now in hindsite) been in NADD's favor, especially after Baba Jobe was ousted. By now all these silly laws (no second round), dissmissing NA memebrs and the like would never have gone on. Nor would we have stood for funny budgets being doctored even more and bi-lateral agreements that shackled us with an insurmountable debt burden! But little this guy does ever makes any sense. The last of which was PULLING out of a winning coalition! I mean, NADD on pure fact and stats won everything they went after in the bi-elections, and by numeracy were looking very very strong indeed. Everyone knew that Jammeh was finished with a united NADD, even Jammeh knew that. that is why he jailed them, to intimidate them all. Sadly now that Darboe has pulled out, everyone also knows that Jammeh will win with a divided oppostion, all thanks to Darboe....AGAIN! Darboe is a spoiler, period. Besides, amongst ALL the top bras of the opposition today: Sallah, Waa Juwara, OJ, Hamat, and Sidia, Darboe is the only person that has NEVER won any seat in government....ever. He refuses to stand for an NA seat, because he is sacred he will lose. But he thinks that people owe him the Presidency! Please, let's get real. So where is all this arrogance and forcefulness for leadership coming from? |
BN |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 19:08:28
|
quote:
Originally posted by OB1
Well said Baldeh! May I say, at this juncture, that the issue is NOT UDP as a party but Darboe as its leader. The most in the UDP party (made up of supporters like you and me and others), are NOT happy with what Darboe has done. He never consulted anyone on his decision to back out of NADD. This is habitual of him to act in a dictatorial and unilateral manner. Let's look at the facts:
1. In 1996, he ran away after polling day to the Senegalese embassy for ‘fear of his life’. Leaving his staunchest supporters behind to wait for any fate that befell them, the APRC made a ‘monkey’ of him later that day during the ceremonies at the J22 square, everyone knows this, and regardless, the top brass of the PPP, NDAM (now) still rallied behind him to lead in 2001: Fast forward to 2002.
2. In 2002 he backed out of the NA elections, claiming that they were unfairly organized. Despite that was only months earlier he had said that the Presidential elections were free and fair. This went against all the opinions of the rest of the UDP top brass that is why Waa Juwara pulled out and formed NDAM. Now let’s look at the 2001 Presidential elections: Rewind to 2001.
3. In 2001 after the presidential election results were announced by GJ Roberts, Darboe decided (on his own, without having the courtesy or foresight as a leader to consult with the leadership of UDP), to call Jammeh and concede. Remember the dialogue? Well let me transcribe the telephone conversation:
Darboe: This is Lawyer Darboe here. Sir, I am calling to concede, and to congratulate you for a well deserved victory……
Jammeh: Thank you.
Darboe: It was a well contested election……
Jammeh: Tell your people to back down, I do not want any trouble from them, understand?
Darboe: Yes, Yes, I do......congratulations, the results were free and fair, and you deserved to win.
Jammeh: I am you daddy!
Darboe: What?
Jammeh: I said, I am your daddy....say it.....
Darboe: Errr, yes, yes, if you say so....
Jammeh: Say it!
Darboe: Yes, you are my daddy.
The above is on record, I heard it so did the whole Gambia. Now tell me, does this man Darboe have the moral and even legitimate authority to hold the whole process of a united opposition to ransom? I think NOT! Let us call a spade a spade and be done with it, and let's move on. Darboe and Hamat can either join, or carry on wasting everyone’s time. If they want to hand the victory over to Jammeh that is their choice, because that seems to be their posturing anyway. But history will not judge them too kindly. They are losing support from within; they are losing credibility from the Diaspora, which is a major source of funding. And they have little backing from the business community in Gambia. Jammeh is trouncing them silly. Let them come back to the fold (NADD), before it is too late. Time is seriously against all of us.
Peace.
BN
I beg to differ. You cannot separate UDP from Darboe. The two are inseparable. Darboe has a mandate of his party to lead them WHERE EVER THEY WANT TO GO. Darboe did not just get there out of the blue. Unfortunately, you are seeing the trees and not the forest. Trying to pick on Darboe as an individual and not a party is divisive. It is just like saying that Halifa does not speak for PDOIS. PDOIS members equally selected Halifa and so are all party chiefs.
Secondly, Darboe congratulating Yaya is not wrong. Unfortunately what Gambian are experiencing is very new in our politics. Since independenec, Gambians were ruled by one person. Therefore the concept of conceding defeat was very new to us. NCP on many occasions would not concede openly like Darboe did. It was a politics of hatred we saw. It is even said that some opposition party chiefs never touched the Gambian dalasi until they died because of the hatred they had for Jawara. They used to hold CFA Francs or the english pound sterling. Even in the west, politicians concede even before results are completed if they see that the uncounted votes would not make any significant change to the out come of the results.
May be Gambians should learn from Bill Clinton when he appointed a Republican as Ambasador to the Gambia. George haley was not a democrat. An opposition is a government in waiting and a government is an oposition in waiting. AFTER ALL, ONLY GAMBIA MATTERS. IF WE CAN ENSURE STABILITY AND SANITY IN POLITICS, THEN NOTHING IS BEYOND OUR REACH.
The issue of Darboe and Jammeh calling each other son or father is a historical bond between people with Jammeh and Darboe last names just like the Sannehs and Drammehs.
Gambian elections were very violent where people have set fires to other opponents homes in the runup to internal self rule and full independence. These divisions ah hatred for party and country delayed our full independence for almost five years. gambian delegations used to meet with the crown not for the interest of the country but for personal gains. In fact the name of one presidential candidate came to signify an enemy or hatred. For example people would say: you are my PDOIS. Meaninig you are my enemy.
That level of hatred is unacceptable in our politics. No party is an enemy. Each is an opponent seeking to lead the nation.
There was a candidate, who used to tour the country with an old telephone set to the villages pretending to be speaking to the Queen in london long before we had wireless phones.
Many fell for the trick and it created divisions which have forever scarred our nation. Such diviions led to the PROTECTORATE PEOPLES PARTY as a rallying force for those who felt left out. Infact, people were required to swear by the Holy Quran that they will forever remain loyal to their parties. That is why, the older generation has found itself trapped in a quagmire. The fear of God's wrath for breaking a covenant was also iminent in their minds.
NCP wil never be in the coalition. Dont even think abou it. Perhaps only when Dibba is not alive. It was after such divisons mellowed down that PPP then became, PROGRESSIVE PEOPLES PARTY.
IT WAS THE FIRST TIME IN OUR POLITICAL HISTORY THAT A PARTY CONCEDED IN SUCH A MANNER.
What is clear and which we all seem not to recognize is the fact that the different parties have different programs, policies and desires as to where they intend to take the country. Therefore you cannot expect those divergent views to be swept under the carpet so soon.
JUST THE SAME WAY PDOIS DOES NOT COMPROMISE ITS PRINCIPLES SO WILL PPP, NDAM OR OTHERS.
I will give you examples. PDOIS does not beat drums during rallies; they do not even cook with supporters. They used to carry their own groceries and cook for themselves before meetings in the villages. These are core principles of our party for various reasons
1. PDOIS does not believe in buying favour by giving out "ASOBIs", money etc
2. The party believes in the independence of the voter
3. It also believes in the sovereignty of the people to make fundamental decisions without being dragged into it.
4. The party also believes voters are matured enough to see the forest and not the trees.
5. The party also does not engage in "pushing" people to get voters cards etc.
These principles may only be found in PDOIS. The rest will give out money, slaughter bulls in villages, pay YAI COMPINS to get votes, ASOBIS, and even tell them to vote for them. We never tell Gambians to vote for us. We show them our programs and let them judge for themselves.
WHAT HAS NOW BECOME CLEAR IS NOT DARBOE OR UDP, BUT OUR DIFFERENCES AS PARTIES IN TERMS OF WHAT WE BELIEVE IN AND STAND FOR.
I never expected a smooth ride because we have different concepts of managing the affairs of our country. If Gambians were really united we would not have all the many parties some of which do not take off beyond registration of their party. I believe we have at least 8 parties( PDOIS, UDP, NRP, GPP, NDAM, APRC, PPP, NCP,ETC) for such a tiny country.
The divisions we are experiencing is a reflection of the divisions in the country period. The country has become so partisan that there cannot be a fruitful coalition. The honest truth is we should not waste our time dreaming with our eyes open. Just like Bismarck, the German Chancellor said “ every one for himself and god for us all..” so should we begin to accept the bitter realty that opposition unity will for ever remain a myth so long as we are not prepared to see beyond our individual desires and have national interest supreme. Then again, national interest cannot be defined. Almost every country has a clause on national interest, which is never defined. It has always remained a prerogative of the leader.
Historical differences between these parties are still valid today and that old habits die-hard. Those historical problems have not yet been solved and until they are, lets forget about a coalition. PPP for example has never forgiven NRP for taking their party trademark color. It might seem insignificant to so, but is at the core of what they stand for and where they have made in roads in Gambian politics for 30 years. There are many problems out there that only manifest itself in the MOU. THERE IS NO FIRE WITHOUT SMOKE.
Unfortunately, as the English say" ADVERSITY BREEDS STANGE BED FELLOWS". NADD is no more than a group of stange bed fellows who in their wildest dreams would never think of coming together. It is an alliance of convenience |
Edited by - kondorong on 09 Aug 2006 19:22:46 |
|
|
|
OB1
84 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 19:34:39
|
| I agree with some of the things you said. But you still failed to point out the facts that can exonerate Darboe from his erratic behavior and mass inconsistencies, further aggravating the situation where instead of uniting he has divided many not only in Gambia but on this forum also, as these exchanges rightly prove. The fact is Darboe erred, and did so many times; he was forgiven on all except this time around. He cannot bully everyone, every time. Sorry. The Mea Culpa is on him. No one else. The fact is IF there is NO UNITED Opposition by August 31st nomination day, Darboe will be blamed for his intransigence, there is ample proof of this. He joined, and pulled out, expecting EVERYONE to put their tools down and follow him. Why? Because he ‘claims’ to have the largest party? If that is the case, then why did he not say that before Feb 17th 2005. Did it take him 18 months to realize that he had the largest majority in opposition? And does he really have this? I doubt it. UDP was a coalition of PPP and NCP and other persons that wanted APRC out in 1996. Darboe ‘stumbled into Politics’, much like Hamat Bah did. Both are products of the 1996 ban on PPP and NCP. Let’s face the facts. Darboe should be reminded that humility does go along way, especially in politics, where the people are your power. And with humility comes integrity and compromise for the common good. |
BN |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 19:49:00
|
I REFUSE TO JUDGE ANY PARTY. THAT IS FOR GAMBIAN VOTERS TO DECIDE WHO SERVES THEIR INTEREST. THAT HAS ALWAYS BEEN A PDOIS MESSAGE FOR DECADES AND I STILL TOW THAT LINE. REMEBER, DARBOE STIIL HAS MANY PEOPLE WHO THINK JUST LIKE HE DOES.YOU HAVE TO SEE BEYOND DARBOE AS AN INDIVIDUAL AND UNDERSTAND THAT IT IS THE COUNTRY WHICH IS IN NEED OF REAL OVERHAUL.
Unfortunately we only seem to be good at blaming others.
DARBOE HAS A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO CHOOSE AND TO ASSOCIATE WITH ANY ONE. THAT RIGHT ALSO GUARANTEES HIM TO NOT ASSOCIATE IN THE FIRST PLACE. HE HAS A RIGHT TO ELECT AND BE ELECTED BUT AT THE SAME TIME HAS A RIGHT TO NOT ELECT OR BE ELECTED.
I am saying this based on constitutional principles which all of us are accorded.
Can you define what common good is. Talk to an APRC supporter. he will tell you that common good lies in APRC and not any party. That is democracy for you. It requires patience to convince people. THEY CANNOT BE FORCED AND THEY SHOULD BE FREE TO MAKE THEIR OWN DECISIONS. This is why PDOIS took many years to be accepted. Slowly but surely we will get there. PDOIS DOES NOT JUDGE OR FORCE. We believe every one has to be a master of his destiny. |
|
|
|
njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 19:59:42
|
quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
........ PDOIS DOES NOT JUDGE OR FORCE. We believe every one has to be a master of his destiny.
are you telling us something or revealing something |
|
|
|
dbaldeh
USA
934 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 20:30:12
|
Kon, you have to separate the facts from fiction. No one is single handedly blaming Darboe for everything. However, at the end of the day the buck stops with the leader. He gets the credit and the criticism of his party's actions.
What you fail to acknowledge is that leadership requires boldness and the ability to consult and delegate. You cannot deny the fact OB1 mentioned about Darboe's inconsistency. It is a sign of weak leadership to take unilateral action without consulting your base. He conceded to Jammeh without consulting his party. It is ok to concede if you are defeated, but you cannot do it when your very supporters are in detention and in the field argueing about the conduct of the elections. He should have waited for a complete report from his field representatives, but he did not.
He later boycotted the paliamentary elections claiming unfairness at the expense of his supporters. What does that say about his leadership?
He ran and hide at the embassy while some of his supporters were being beaten to death on the campaign trail. What does that say about his willingness to sacrifice together with his people?
He mentioned several times that he is taken precautions and makes sure he is at home 7pm everyday. What does that say about his willingness to sacrifice with his people and for the country?
I can go on and on just like OB1 did. The fact of the matter is that because of Darboe's weakness as a leader, UDP's interest has not been represented well especially at the negotiation table. As a leader, your followers look up to you to make decisive decisions while keeping them informed. I was a big supporter of the UDP and over and over again, we have seen signs of weakness especially towards Jammeh.
My fear is that when Darboe become President, because of his down to earth, non confrontational attitude, we will go back to Jawara days where you can get away with anything. Gambia must not return to the status quo of the first republic. So the point is not about Darboe being singled out, but about his ability to confront issues head on. |
Baldeh,
"Be the change you want to see in the world" Ghandi
Visit http://www.gainako.com for your daily news and politics |
|
|
|
blackerberry2004
69 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 20:58:25
|
| Baldeh and OB1, you two said it well. Democracy is when the majority exerts its will on the minority. Time and time again, we see that the majority could very well be wrong. In democracy, voting for a leader means that you are entrusting your fate to that person. However, a leader can betray you or your party's trust after gaining your vote through false pretense. Specifically, Darboe can exhibit good or poor leadership qualities even though he got the mandate to lead. If we can't personalize the leadership, then let's drop our pens and keyboards and quit blaming Jammeh for poor leadership because he got the mandate of the people (53%) and APRC. So as you can see, I disagree with your logic Kons. As a matter of fact, I align myself with PDOIS than any other party, yet I can hold Halifa or Sedia responsible for any acts of unbecoming a leader. |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:23:41
|
I was responding to OB1 when he said that the issue is not with UDP but with Darboe. The two are inseparable. Darboe is the face of UDP. If you say UDP has no problem but Darboe has, then you must be dreaming.
That is why there is a leader. Darboe represents the views of his political constituency. One thing OB1 needs to realize is that whilst its ok to criticize Darboe within the context of his party, it is not ok to single him out as an individual; because as an individual, he really does not matter. The reason why he matters is because of UDP and therefore if DArboe has a problem then UDP has a problem too. THE TWO ARE IN SEPERABLE.
Baldeh
"My fear is that when Darboe become President, because of his down to earth, non-confrontational attitude, we will go back to Jawara days where you can get away with anything. Gambia must not return to the status quo of the first republic."
Your quotation clearly indicates some frustration. However we do not need confrontational people in government. We need leaders who respect laws and not arrogant, stiff-necked fools. Leading a nation is like sailing a boat, avoiding storms, managing the waves with the hope arriving in one piece. Being stubborn with conditions only leads to a shipwreck. Sierra Leone and Liberia are classic examples. We have heard cries for sacrifice. What has happened to Omar Barrow, Deday Hydara, Koro Ceesay, and countless others. Have Gambians risen to defend them. Where was Halifa, Sedia, Darboe, Hamat bah, Waa Juwara, Assan Musa, Oj etc when these people died. Did any one lead demonstration in the country to show our unhappiness. Currently Bajinak is on the run for his life. April 10 in which 12 students were shot to dead is still with us. Where was every Gambian. With a population of 1.5 million, all of us went under our beds or looked the other way as though their lives did not matter. They died, because we can taste freedom. The least we can do is to fill the streets at least and say NOT IN OUR NAME.
How many Gambians ever sent a butut to these families help school fees. They have children and left behind their wives and only fending for themselves. It s easy to sit on a key board and argue, but am not sure if any one of us will ever cough in the streets of Banjul. SOMETIMES THERE IS A THIN LINE BETWEEN BRAVERY AND MADNESS.
Infact Baldeh why are you not happy with APRC. Certainly they are very confrontational or are you saying they have not been rough enough with Gambians. I hope you have not drank the magic water.
Blackberry
"As a matter of fact, I align myself with PDOIS than any other party, yet I can hold Halifa or Sedia responsible for any acts of unbecoming a leader".
Your above qoute refers.
Well blackberry, i am not sure if there are any NADD supporters who are willing to criticize their leader especially when it comes to Halifa or Sedia. I am A keen follower of online Gambian blogs, but criticism has always been a one way traffic which leads to the camps of other parties. We are so blinded by our support; we will never see any mistakes even if they are there. This rush to morale high ground regarding our party is what has made it difficult for us to see any good in any one except halifa or sedia . Unfortunately, the two are very humble personalities who listen to everyone. A sense of fanaticism is what i am worried about. It is no less than the sycophancy we saw in the GREEN BOYS. Congratulations Blackberry for saying that. I AM NOT JUST SURE IF YOU WILL EVER PUT THAT INTO PRACTICE.
For nearly two decades, PDOIS has always been right. I have not seen any dissent within PDOIS camp where party members have been brave enough to challenge their leadership. That worries me a lot.
|
Edited by - kondorong on 09 Aug 2006 23:56:37 |
|
|
|
njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:30:26
|
| so kondorong are you socialist and/or communist?? |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:35:27
|
| I am a democrat |
|
|
|
kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:35:51
|
| GOOD QUESTION ! I WANNA SEE KON'S ANSWER TO THAT .HE HIS A GREAT PERSON AND I WANNA SEE HIS IDEOLOGICAL ORIENTATION. |
|
|
|
kayjatta
2978 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:38:23
|
| SOCIAL DEMOCRAT OR WHAT ? |
|
|
|
njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:40:41
|
quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
I am a democrat
i dont trust you.thats not an answer. democracy or dictatorship is not an orientation but a method.
i asked about your ideology, socialist, communist,capitalist,liberal ?????? |
|
|
|
kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 22:41:02
|
You see quite contray to many believes that in socialist societies the citizens committees make decisons, in actual fact they dont. Few people hold power and its made seemingly as though decisions are concensus. Lookk at North Korea, with all the famine, their leader is almost worship in the Great Peoples Hall.
Some may argue that societies did not have true socialist ideals. Which ever way, they could not hold on. THERE IS NOTHING MORE PRECIOUS THAN TO HAVE THE FREEDOM TO BE WHO YOU WANT TO BE.
Even mandela did talk about this in the early days of the ANC. |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
| Bantaba in Cyberspace |
© 2005-2024 Nijii |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
