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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
 Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 20:12:08
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This OJ thing seem to surface in forums all the time, and most of the times, i realized bias postings and attitude from contributors to the topic. Such biasness couldn't be by accident. A clear manifesto was some of the comments from respected elders and elites, whom people of the junior calibre look unto for directions during the flag bearer impasse; most of which were even tribal-that his father is from Guinea etc...To the point, even when you say something good about Oj, you are termed a ppp, or it is such a taboo in forums to associate oneself to ppp.
I was too young to be ppp, and not the least related to OJ, except by citizenzip and clan, last name. OJ was never my choice of candidature for the flag bearer position.
Way forward: Moe cannot deny that OJ was part of the ppp, and secondary that the ppp got us to this day, directly or indirectly giving birth to the tyranny of Yaya Jammeh. The ppp liberated us for independence, and they took to fantasy by inviting the teri-kafo business. They were peaceful, except the case for 81 coup, which one will be right to pin it on Kukoi samba saitaneh. There were a lot divided families, and sometimes minorities experienced tribalism. Most jobs were offered on 'know me basis', and some poor families were isolated. The situation now under jammeh is multiplied a thrillion times. Atleast the ppp or OJ were not monstrous like Jammeh.
Since i joined this forum in oct 2004, i realized that the two-Moe and Kj have a lot of differences in their debates. I don't like their language of '****', but which grown man never used the words. Instead of the personal debate, they can just debate the topic, for or against the ppp.
Some times fence neatrality is thought to be a hypocritic stance, and sidetaking is worst than the later.
Proof: OJ didn't run after the 94 coup, he was arranged before the commissions and none of that report suggest that the man embezzled, and the kangaroo enquiry was even from an enermy to a whole nation, moreso the ministers he overthrew.The guy is still constant, though aging, but his stance on advocacy is constant. Like a respected gone member of this forum, Amna, likened OJ to that of bill Clinton, where his sexual records probably is what we can hold him, but that he is/was the Malcolm x of many movements. For a fact, in forums when we talk about ppp, everyone seem to dwell more on OJ, and OJ wasn't the only ppp. What happened to the thousand others, some of whom are living betrayals to our nations. If not for tribal politics, they are dancing to a bading kafo movement.
I will be fine with one stealing my things, and spare my life. Maybe a chance to sprout again.
But Now: lets say, we charge OJ for thiefry activities or broadly the ppp. Then we will charge jammeh for all the human rights violations and thiefry activities in the open. How then are the two comparable.D.T.M fellows ! The two administrations cannot be compared due to the fact of mass human dehumanization currently and in the past observed in this tiny west african nation.
My respect for OJ: Despite this man being jailed and tortured many times, he is till in for a democratic movement. In a miraculous move, he gave up a flag bearer aspiration, thus bringingthe tussle to three. He showed no selfishness by being there for Gambians then and now-where are all the others ? Probably, enjoying their flights between Dakar JFK or Dakar London.
With Omega, her stance on things are odd sometimes. From her pieces, she seem to support heated arguements of insults describing it as 'the forum has been boring of late'. When will you condemn the atrocities taking place in the Gambia ? When will you condemn the hacking of newspapers ? When will you condemn the closure of a whole institution -the independent ? Your way of activism sound scary-when the london terror attack occured, we saw you make movements -as if terror in london is not equal to terror in the Gambia. But for a fact, she was in the Gambia not long ago, probably was the guest to FJC, her favorite.
The sooner we stop being bias, the faster we will progress as Africans. To those contributors here, notably Kobo, Kondorong,jany etcc.. who lived the ppp era as youths, probably can tell us more what happened then. This doen't mean that some **** didn;t happen then, but my question is what is its magnitude compared to today ?
In conclusion, the ppp cannot be compared to jammeh's brute administration.With respect to the call of the genuines, i reinstate that moe and KJ agree and disagree without the **** language.In forums or movements, we shouldn't just agree to be water waves being carried in all directions.
I rest my case ! |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 20:36:55
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I did not live through PPP as a youth. I was in school. I guess i just like to do research. I am certainly no living authority. I have said it here that PPP also has some blame to take. OJ unfortunately seems more popular with PPP. One can comfaortably say he is their trademark. The man was very popular apart from Jawara. HE WAS A MAN OF THE ORDINARY PERSON AND THAT MAKES HIM QUITE ADORED.
However, there were other people in the party who were opular but certainly not the kind of broad support OJ has across the entire country. I respect his stance on democracy and as a leader, he will certainly not run. He is know in the international circles as a defender of rights.
May be Dalton1 you know Gambiabetter than i do and probabaly even more because of your role as a journalist. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 21:37:24
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| Dalton 1 what I can say about O.J. is I am proud of the ride accorded to me and squeezing so close to him in his ministerial car on my way to the stadium. I believe he has contributed a lot in Youth, Sports and many Community development projects. Even President Jammeh used to "hang around" with his younger brother and many "ndongos". Thanks. |
Edited by - kobo on 23 Jun 2006 21:39:06 |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 23:38:27
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Kondorong, i took rectification in the piece. But it seems to me you are atleast in your early 40s or late 30s just old enough to remember what the ppp was truly like. For the records, i was never a journalist in the Gambia, just wrote on things-supported by Alieu Khan, of the former Observer & Gamsu. However, i took some journal classes, something i do for hobby. I take admiration in Galleh, Cherno Baba, late Deyda etc...I know very little about the Gambia, though do a lot of research and documentation about facts just like you.
Thanks Kobo, are you telling us is all about the ride you had ? (laughter !) Rideon Kobo, tell us more of that then ?
Well back to the debate, I wonder when we will we see Madam Denton released ? Also, to start surfing the editorials of the gallant independent ? And to see the killers of Deyda, Koro and our 14 students brought to justice ? And to accord a state burial to the UDP mps that died in the gele-gele accident, while on active duty ? And to see a court order reinstating mayor Jeng of Banjul respected ?And to see terror and fear conquered ?
Was anything of the like in the PPP then? |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 00:03:25
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Sorry for that. I had thought you were a journalist but you would cvertainly make one . I am not in my mid 30s yet. As for the rides, OJ was far better than all the ministers in PPP. He would pack students in his car to Banjul whilst most of his colleages would pass by not even looking.
Well the kind of suppression of press freedom is not known in the days of PPP nor did we see the mass arrests or dismissals of this day. Most supporters of PDOIS came from the quadrangle who openly went to the court house to nominate and indicating their adresses and place of work. I have not heard of any reprisals. Most people would even pose for the papers for the opposition nominations. Even employees at state house would attend such nominations.
Even though Ticks (sana Manneh) was harassed, he had the courage to attack people in high office which i cannot imagine happening now. He would walk the streets of banjul with no problem and even in the quadrangle.
I have not heard of arrests of political leaders. Certainly both Sedia and Halifa were public servants and i have read the letter of resignation of Mr Jatta from the civil service. The tone of the letter was such that he could only have done so during PPP. No one in the civil service would dare write such a resignation letter and live to be nominated a Presidential candidate. Foroyya publish his resignation letter at some point. |
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kobo
United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 01:30:13
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| Kons I adore you are 60 (30x2). Revered, great thinker and philosopher. May be age depends on the mind power and not time of birth? Are you an alien as somethimes you refer to historical events vividly even before you were born (for under 30). Which planet do you come from Kons? |
Edited by - kobo on 24 Jun 2006 01:30:53 |
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LEMON TIME
Afghanistan
1295 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 01:41:01
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| Kondorong may come from Jupiter |
There is no god but Allah |
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 01:55:11
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| I am from Sare Bojo |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 01:55:39
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Kondorong, short & nice piece. Kobo thinks you are older than you said you are, but let him be reminded of seaches. That's all it takes to be a historian. Sometimes living through certain things doesn't mean awareness to those events, but for a fact researching on any detail is certain to give you clear clues. Kondorong might not be only one guilty of such narrations.Probably, one of those kids that warmed themselves by the fire and listening traditional story telling.
By the way, nice weekend to all ! |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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kondorong
Gambia
4380 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 01:59:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalton1
Kondorong, short & nice piece. Kobo thinks you are older than you said you are, but let him be reminded of seaches. That's all it takes to be a historian. Sometimes living through certain things doesn't mean awareness to those events, but for a fact researching on any detail is certain to give you clear clues. Kondorong might not be only one guilty of such narrations.Probably, one of those kids that warmed themselves by the fire and listening traditional story telling.
By the way, nice weekend to all !
AAN NON, ACHU DEH. DUM KO CHOSAN HALDA. WANA MAIBEH TAN YURRMINI (FULANI) |
Edited by - kondorong on 24 Jun 2006 02:03:12 |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 02:17:13
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quote:
Originally posted by kondorong
By the way, nice weekend to all !
AAN NON, ACHU DEH. DUM KO CHOSAN HALDA. WANA MAIBEH TAN YURRMINI (FULANI)
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direct translation "you, stop it. You spoke typical culture. Sympathy is not only for the dead.", Kondorong.
Pular mah nah fehwih-very fluent in pular. Now, you vindicated kobo.
foh watikoteng, kata m'ri kunkohto-fatakoiyoo, foh namoo yeh joh dorong. |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Sister Omega
United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 09:15:31
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Dalton, you are a Joker man what are you trying to do to get a reaction a guest of FJC By the way what happened to your serious serialisation with FJC? I never did catch all of it. Of course Denton must have access to legal representation and for a relatives to Know how she is doing etc etc. As for the Independent hasn't the owner been released on D50,000 this week a step in the right direction don't you think? Under states of alert, states will do whatever they consider is appropriate to secure their country. This was and still is the case in London, and in The Gambia with the attempted coup insighting violence is just as serious as doing the crime in law, and a presume with the Independence's stance over the years, it is not really surprising that it was closed down. Yes Dalton I was in Gambia during the attempted coup and I brought a copy of all the newspapers apart from the Daily Observer which was sold out. Now for the Foroyaa that is what I call a quality newspaper which substantiates its claims not just wielding wild accusations around curing favour.
Peace
Sister Omega
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Peace
Sister Omega |
Edited by - Sister Omega on 24 Jun 2006 09:37:03 |
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somita
United Kingdom
163 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 14:04:07
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Dalton I beg to disagree on OJ issue. While its good news to see the OJ back on the political platform with a reformed agender, one that i strongly support today it is equally not hard to see the skeptisism on the man. He was part of a system that denied Gambians their fundamental rights to basic knowledge and health for 30 odd years while the system's top brass and their families lived like kings and queens largly at the expense of the tax payers.
May i say there is nothing like innocent by-standers, OJ cannot be innocents on the wrongs of PPP, if anything he was part of PPP's propaganda and thinking machine and therefore is guilty of the small and big wrongs of PPP. I was young but I know he wans't a small fish, infact he was the top ranks.
I have to say am very worried on the precedence here, in principle you are saying that Yankuba Touray is innocent of all the wrongs of APRC even though he is fully informed and is fully aware. If OJ comes out as he did or is doing to appologise to Gambians, of course that is left to individuals to forgive or forget but rebranding him as innocent by-standers is like adding salt to injury. I only hope that this is not the begining of a PR excersice, because if it is, it will surely back fire.
No one is advocating that that PPP sat on comfortable chairs in Quandrangle and state hourse and did nothing for 30 years, surely not on this forum, however history has shown that they got the priorities wrong. Evidence show that they probably failed on every measureable stop on the way, health, education, social justice, Agriculture, you name it, none of these faculties have a good footing up to date.
Some suggesting that he did alot in sports, sports? I'm deeply surprise about OJ record on sports. Folks, i dont think we ever won gold in olympics or any other sports since independance not even commonwealth ..... the best we get was silver, sports facilities outsides the Kombos are virtually non-exisitence ....where is the contribution to sports! Is this a joke?
I think over the past years OJ has reformed and is well armed with both experience and hind-sight, therefore will be a great tool to any goverment and indeed will benefit Gambians at alarge. On the flip side of the coin, he was part of dark history but has reformed and we all hope he will stay reformed and will go on contribute to a better Gambia.
Never deny history, instead print it in bold letters only then we shall all gallop farward. |
Edited by - somita on 24 Jun 2006 14:07:55 |
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Dalton1
3485 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jun 2006 : 00:47:39
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My brother Somita,
I almost agreed with all you said, but for a fact opinioned that some biasness against OJ might be rooted in some of us. Looking at your piece, you termed him a "reformed" individual, which you said is a credit that Gambians can benefit from, but vehemently denied that he performed in the then Jawara administration.I am sure there is a lot to agree on in dwelling on the failures of the PPP, but in a comparison, one cannot compare these two administrations. Also, if you realized, which am sure you did, forums seems to dwell only or more on OJ whenever this PPP failures are under discussion. In my piece above, i said OJ was inclusive in the PPP package that gave birth to a living tyranny today.
I am in no way qualified to make OJ innocent in his deeds, but his courage to appear before a commission then speaks volumes, secondary to his "reformed" lifestyle, if you would like to put it, makes him far too cry from others, who shared the cake with him then, and now that Gambians are sweating under the whimps and caprices of a tyrannical adminstration, they are never there for us.
Omega, i can see your problem in the piece you wrote. I am sorry, but you seem to have a lot of grudges and anger against the independent. What for ? You said state insecurity . I put it to you that those cowards are the very threat to the security of the Gambian citizenry.The coup piece from lamin fatty mentioning Samba bah, of then Interior and Intelligence, was mistaken for another Samba Bah, and the piece was rectified the next day. Does this one piece warrant a closure to a whole institution ? I don't think so. You hailed foroyya, but contradicted yourself, because foroyya is constant at exposing the evils of this Government, also condemned openly the many wrongs they committed. Lawyer Denton is denied access to lawyers, where were all this time comrade ? I rest it. |
"There is no god but Allah (SWT); and Muhammad (SAW)is His last messenger." shahadah. Fear & Worship Allah (SWT) Alone! (:
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Dembish
Gambia
284 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jun 2006 : 01:21:13
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| interesting guys, but onething Gambians seems to be taken away by jammehs rapids infrasturals changes and there by assuming that ppp did nothing, I think they have done something and deserved their due nomatter what.the pace was not that good but economically Gambians were living a better life in comparison to Aprc era.Even now the Aprc has not even build half of the number of health centres the PPP built across the country.yes that is politic, once you are no longer in office all your achivements are trashed in the bin, who evercomes tomorrow will come with another method different from jammehs. But for now let give the devil its due.I just wonder who among us have seen the Gambia at the time the british handed it over to jawara,then was the the hardest time but thanks to ppp jammeh was even able to use a school bus to go to a high school on a motorable highway. |
There is no egg without a chicken, and no chicken without egg. |
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