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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
 Posted - 11 Dec 2006 : 10:59:22
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General Pinochet, Melosovic, Sadam, Husain, Yahya Jammeh, Charles Taylor, Mobutu, Sani Abacha, Edi Amin, Samuel Doe. These and many more are known by characteristics identified as dictatorial. Among the most visible of their nature are, suppressing and killing innocent citizens, selfish, greed, getting rich while their population keeps poorer, overseas fat bank accounts, and many more. Can you think of other dictators and what they share(d)with those in this list? They make friends with other dictators as a backup. During their life time, they are surrounded by sycophants and fellow exploiters to boost their ego above the void clouds. In their final days, they die(d) disgraced leaving their subjects broken and regreting. Do people have to keep dictators after knowing the final days will only bring regrets? Your say in this is your power.
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Karamba |
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serenata
Germany
1400 Posts |
Posted - 11 Dec 2006 : 12:07:00
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Karamba, I often wondered why people who don't belong to the group you called rightly 'fellow exploiters' support dictators. I think that in the beginning they see only the 'strong man' they can rely on, a father figure who solves their (real or imaginary) problems, sets things in order and disburdens them from responsibilities. Later, when it is too late and the dictator has installed a system of denunciation and (psycho-)terror they realize that every relief has its costs - and that this one in special has very high costs.
Significantly, in hard times the tendency to support a dictator is even stronger. This is why dictators, e.g. Hitler, even can be democratically elected. When Hitler came to power Germany suffered a lot - the absurd (and, as we know today, unjust) reparations of World War I. and the Black Friday had an enormous economical impact on the nation; the (artificially boosted) national honour was deeply wounded. With Hitler, a 'leader' emerged who promised to solve ALL problems, economical and psychological. Dictators play with human needs, this makes them successful.
Anyway, Pinochet at least is dead now. May he have an unpleasant afterlife. |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 11 Dec 2006 : 15:55:15
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Serenata,
You have broken into the deeper bones of dictators, shattering their bare marrow. Hitler had all the guts to embark on his senseless adventures and he nearly succeeded. It is hard to see his as success. Anything that claims mass suffering and loss of lives in the hands of one or group of ruthless persons can never be justly called victory. In the narrow holes of their skulls, dictators still want to be seen heroes. You have landed well on the grounds that dictators are created. First they create the atmosphere and impose it on rest of the people to accept the horrible reign. When they face resistance, dictators can be reduced to the most timid creators. Their growth and expansion can be interefered and put under control. Fortunately, this is possible in Gambia. Yahya Jammeh has not attained the scale of full blown dictatorship. When confronted with stubborn resistance, he will run out of breath like fish out of water. Deep inside him, he consoles himsef with the false notion of commanding dictatorial powers. It is not late for Gambians to unseat him. He already scared his makers. Some of the people around him would rather choose a world without him. Let truth and justice triumph. |
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sab
United Kingdom
912 Posts |
Posted - 12 Dec 2006 : 19:14:55
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We posted on this subject September last year & I have copied/ paste couple of my postings - there are some good readings under Type of leader (s) Gambia needs / look at the coup characteristic
THE MODERN WORLD AFRICAN COUP LEADERS; Mobutu Ses Seko – Dictator of Congo; 1st coup in 1960 – when Patrice Lumumba was killed. Seko handed power to President Kasavubu; stages 2nd Coup in 1965. Changes name of country to Zaire. Changes name to Mobutu Sese Seko Koko Ngbendu Wa Za Banga - Looted the country amassing one of the world’s largest fortunes abroad. Robert Mugabe – President of Zimbabwe -1964 Imprisoned for ten years for political activities. While in prison organised a coup & emerged from prison as Zanu’s leader. 1980 won elections. 1984 establishes one-party state. 2002 – Re-elected president in fixed election. Jean Bedel Bokassa – President of Central African Republic – stages Military Coup to oust Dacko and declared himself president. Crowns himself emperor in a ceremony that practically bankrupts the country. Began a reign of terror, taking all important government posts to himself. 1979, hundreds of school children arrested for refusing to wear uniforms made in a factory he owned. He personally supervised the massacre of 100 children by his Imperial Guard. Idi Amin –President of Uganda 1971 – Ousts Milton Obete in coup; becomes president – estimated between 100,000 & 300,000 Ugandans were tortured & murdered during his reign. Dies in exile in Saudi Arabia. Mengistu Haile Mariam – Ruler of Ethiopia – plotted coup 1974– deposing Emperor Haile Selassie. Urged the killing of 60 leaders of the Imperial Regime. Haile Selassie strangled on Mengistu orders. Makes himself head of state; unleashes ‘Red Terror campaign. Drafts new constitution. Elected President under its provisions. 1991 Flees to fellow dictator Robert Mugabe in Zimbabwe. Samuel Doe – Dictator of Liberia – As master sergeant stages coup 1980. Brutally suppresses opposition & installs his own tribe in tops posts. Rigs election – Allows Army to loot country. Civil War. Hissen Habre – Dictator of Chad – Seized power 1982 – Commission accuses Habre of 40,000 murders & 200,000 cases of torture. Flees to Senegal. Saddam Hussein – President of Iraq – Unsuccessful assassination attempt on Iraqi President Kassim. Fled to Egypt. Seized power in 1963, imprisoned late that year. Staged another coup in 1968. Consolidated power as head of State 1979 by putting to death hundreds of rivals. Invades Iran. Gases the Kurds. Invades Kuwait. Kwame Nkrumah President of Ghana - 1951 Wins election – leaves prison & takes office. 1958 Introduces imprisonment without trial. 1964 declares one-party state with himself as president for life. 1966 – Deposed in coup. Charles Taylor - President of Liberia - Civil War - mutilation of civilians - including women & children. 2003 Taylor indicted for war crimes by UN.........A lesson to Peace??
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The world would be a poorer place if it was peopled by children whose parents risked nothing in the cause of social justice, for fear of personal loss. (Joe Slovo - African revolutionary) |
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sab
United Kingdom
912 Posts |
Posted - 12 Dec 2006 : 19:18:19
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This CHILLING list continues from September 05 Modern Tyrants OUTSIDE of Africa
MODERN TYRANTS VIA A COUP / OUTSIDE OF AFRICA…… Porfirio Diaz – Dictator of Mexico – Distinguishes himself in the War of the Reform. Helps overthrow the French-backed regime in Mexico. Stages abortive coup against Benito Judrez. Elected President. Dispossesses the poor & terrorises Indian communities. Fixes election. Vladimir Lenin – Leader of the USSR – Returns to Russia in closed train; seizes power; signs armistice with Germany; begins civil war. Orders the execution of the tsar and his family. Wins civil war. 1921 – 1923 Famine caused by collectivisation of farming – six million dead. Josef Stalin – Leader of the USSR – Plays prominent part in October Revolution – When Lenin died, Stalin tool over, ruthlessly crushing all opposition. 1928 came the Five Year Plan to industrialise Russia, funded by the export of grain, and continued the collectivisation of farming which resulted in famine, mostly in Ukraine. Those who resisted in any way were executed, and a peasant’s revolt was savagely put down. It is estimated that 25million people perished as a result of collectivisation. 1934, Stalin organised the murder of his potential rival Sergey Kirov, and used the assassination as a pretext for a purge. Between 1936 & 1938 there was a series of show trails, with thousands of party officials and senior army officers found guilty of treason & executed. By 1939, of the 1,966 delegates to the 1934 party congress that had backed Kirov, 1,108 were dead; of the 139 members elected to the Central Committee that year, 98 were dead. Meanwhile Stalin’s secret police had arrested millions of ordinary people, executing, exiling or imprisoning them in labour camps. Signs pact with Hitler. Imprisons returning prisoners of war. Benito Mussolini – Dictator of Italy – 1918 – advocates the emergence of a dictator; hints that he might be the man. Marches on Rome; becomes Italy’s youngest prime minister with dictatorial powers. 1924 Secures power with fraudulent election; murder opponents. 1935 Invades Abyssinis, gassing & bombing the populace. 1936 – Annexes Abyssinia, announcing new Roman Empire; signs Pact of Steel with Hitler; Invades Albania, joins war on Hitler’s side; attacks France, Greece & Egypt. Rafael Trujillo – Dictator of the Dominican Republic – 1927 Becomes commanding General of the Army. 1930 Ousts President Horacio Vasquez; seizes power and instigates one-party rule. Put members of his family in key political offices & murdered all those who opposed him. The Dominican Republic’s one political party also controlled the press. Members of congress handpicked by Trujillo& competing units of secret policemen reporting directly to Trujillo suppressing any political activity. 1937 – Massacred 20,000 migrant farmers. Francisco Franco – Dictator of Spain. Youngest General in the Army, he rose to become chief. Popular Front won election – Franco exiled to the Canary Islands. From there he organised a Nationalist conspiracy that led to outbreak of Spanish Civil War. Nationalists established their own government with Franco at its head. It is estimated 50,000 were executed, murdered or assassinated. A further half a million were killed in the Spanish Civil War, with another half-a-million dead from starvation and disease. With the end of the Civil War, Franco became dictator of Spain. He outlawed all opposition parties & imprisoned & executed thousands of Loyalists. Fulgencio Batista Zaldivar – Dictator of Cuba – 1933 stages ‘sergeants revolt’ and rules Cuba from behind the scenes as army chief of staff. Elected President. Retires to Florida a wealthy man. 1952, returns to power in Cuba after bloodless coup. His second period in office was marked by brutal repression, with Batista controlling the press, the universities & the Congress with an iron fist, embezzling huge sums from the soaring economy. Ngo Dinh Diem – President of South Vietnam – From exile he returns as Prime minister in Bao Dais government in South Vietnam. 1955 Ousts Bao Da in fixed election; declares himself a republic & names himself president. Ruthlessly repressed political dissenters * religious factions, and installed members of his family in important jobs. Responds to failed coup with brutal repression, killing hundreds of Buddhists on the grounds they are aiding the Communist North. Achmed Sukarno - President of Indonesia - When the Dutch were forced to concede sovereignty in 1949, Sukarno quickly established himself in the lavish palace. Won the election, but his government were notoriously corrupt. After extracting a billion dollars worth of aid from the US, he switched sides in the Cold War & took a billion dollars from the Soviet Union. In 1959 he dissolved parliament & in 1963 made himself president for life. He became fearful of a military coup and in 1965 approved a Communist backed plot to kidnap six top army generals who were tortured, mutilated and murdered. General Suharto, reacted by slaughtering more than 300,000 Communist suspects. Francois Duvalier – President of Haiti - After serving as minister of health, he became president in a fixed election in 1957. Consolidating his power, employing ruthless thugs called ‘Tonton Macoutes’ to terrorise the populace & assassinate suspected opponents of the regime. Imprisons deputy, later murdering him. 1961 Fixes legislative elections; extends term of office. 1963 – Begins cult of personality. 1964 – Becomes president for life. Alfredo Stroessner – Dictator of Paraguay - Backed a successful coup against President Morinago. 1954 ousted President Federico Chavez, becomes president after winning an election in which he was the sole candidate. 1967 and 1977 the constitution had to be modified to legitimise his six consecutive elections. Prevented Pope John Paul 11 from meeting opposition leaders. Ousted in military coup. Augusto Pinochet – President of Chile – Stages coup 1973. 14,000 people were tried and executed or expelled from the country. Under Pinochets tyrannical rule, it is estimated that 20,000 people were killed and torture widespread. Efrain Montt - Dictator of Guatemala - Stages coup – begins genocide of Mayans. A report by UN found that at least 448 villages – mostly Indian – had been wiped off the map. According to Amnesty International, in four months more than 2,000 fully documented extra judicial killings by the Guatemalan army: People of all ages were shot, burned alive, hacked to death, disembowelled, drowned & beheaded. Uncovering the truth behind a massacre or disappearance of upwards of 200,000 people during the civil war & the genocide of the Mayan people continues. Pol Pot – Leader of Cambodia – Overthrows US-backed government; declares Year Zero. Money & property were abolished. Books were burnt. Private houses were demolished; temples desecrated every symbol of Western technology – from cars to medical equipment destroyed. Cambodia was transformed into a slave labour camp. All professional people - including doctors & teachers – were killed. Any person who spoke French or wore glasses, which was considered the mark of an intellectual. Their children buried alive. 4years rule saw 1.7million people die as a result of disease, starvation, maltreatment, forced labour, torture & execution. Info gleaned from TYRANTS – History’s 100 most evil Despots & Dictators by Nigel Cawthorne. – 2004…….
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The world would be a poorer place if it was peopled by children whose parents risked nothing in the cause of social justice, for fear of personal loss. (Joe Slovo - African revolutionary) |
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sab
United Kingdom
912 Posts |
Posted - 12 Dec 2006 : 19:26:17
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time to take a look at some of the basics of known tyrants.. Bokassa – Army. Amin – Army. Seko – Army. Mariam – Army. Habre – Army. Montt – Military. Doe Military. Hussein – Refused military Academy. Mugabe trained to become teacher. The aforementioned did not choose a path ‘endowed with compassion’, or had the slightest commitment to the common good and to the service of people’ did they? It was a complete requisite Army ‘temperament.’ Perhaps ‘ a born diplomat’ is what you are looking for. I also had a look at other Modern Tyrants outside of Africa who came via a coup. I will put these on a separate posting. Unfortunately it is large. Taking an overall look the career paths were; 14 Army/military - 4Government Officers - 3 Journalists – 2Teachers - 1Medic. Where it could be found, three came from wealthy families, three from middle class and three from farming communities. I see it firstly as POWER; then ‘conquest of the country’ which must be demonstrated by ferocious & vicious crimes to humanity. All showed a self-possessed corrupt arrogant manner. But, just how did a handful of extremists come via a coup be responsible for destroying so many millions of lives? I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT SOMEWHERE IN OUR ‘DNA’ IS THE EVIDENCE THAT MAKES THESE SPINE-CHILLING BLOODTHIRSTY MADMEN TICK DIFFERENTLY TO THE REST OF US!. Someday it will come to the attention of a Professor of Physics..………sab
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The world would be a poorer place if it was peopled by children whose parents risked nothing in the cause of social justice, for fear of personal loss. (Joe Slovo - African revolutionary) |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 12 Dec 2006 : 19:49:15
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Is it nature or nuture?
Then circumstances. They are ALLOWED to have their will by other people standing by and doing nothing. I have so much respect for anyone that stands up to a tyrant. |
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 12 Dec 2006 : 22:22:52
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Sab,
You have done the greatest justice to the issue. This is a deep cut into the flesh of dictators and a mutilation of their tyranical souls. History is not just about keeping good memory of events. Sadly, I was told at elementary school that "History is the study of important past events and /or people" What do we do with the rest? Who and what is important? Who and what is not important? What and what can we make of people, things, and events in this never-ending process of life?
Committing to memory events and people behind them is not the total value of history. History is a source of power. It is the rendering of reality for analytical reasoning. Interpreting history is the best way to earn most valuable lessons. It is in one of local Gambian sayings that "Ku ndobin reyi sa mam, do gissay lu nyull regal." Translated directly the saying warns that for a person whose grandmother was killed by a black wild bird, you have reason to be scared at the sight of a black object. That is part of interpreting history. This vast amount of knowledge about dictators serves us to analyse and interprete our own circumstances. Like the person who would not stand a black object as in the quoted local proverb, what do Gambians have to wait for? Dictators often start it by the bullet, then by the ballot, then by the bullet. So they do. Digging into the list of characteristics and manners of conduct as revealed by Sab's elaborate material, how many of them are can we identify with Gambia today? From general to specific, it is easier to judge if we have tyranical dictatorship in Gambia or not. Do we have to condone it or disown it? By not letting the growth of it, we are near a solution. Having more people refusing to accept the pratice of dictatorship in Gambia, we can wipe it once and for all. Gambiabev summed it all by concluding that we must stand together to destroy dictatorship. These good ideas coming from serious persons like yourselves will lead us to ending dictatorship in all its form and essence. Over to you. |
Karamba |
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mbay
Germany
1007 Posts |
Posted - 14 Dec 2006 : 12:27:57
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You catch the point!
A very few comes in as Dictators but soon or later their faces
Changes from milk face to blood face.
quote:
Originally posted by serenata
Karamba, I often wondered why people who don't belong to the group you called rightly 'fellow exploiters' support dictators. I think that in the beginning they see only the 'strong man' they can rely on, a father figure who solves their (real or imaginary) problems, sets things in order and disburdens them from responsibilities. Later, when it is too late and the dictator has installed a system of denunciation and (psycho-)terror they realize that every relief has its costs - and that this one in special has very high costs.
Significantly, in hard times the tendency to support a dictator is even stronger. This is why dictators, e.g. Hitler, even can be democratically elected. When Hitler came to power Germany suffered a lot - the absurd (and, as we know today, unjust) reparations of World War I. and the Black Friday had an enormous economical impact on the nation; the (artificially boosted) national honour was deeply wounded. With Hitler, a 'leader' emerged who promised to solve ALL problems, economical and psychological. Dictators play with human needs, this makes them successful.
Anyway, Pinochet at least is dead now. May he have an unpleasant afterlife.
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Karamba
United Kingdom
3820 Posts |
Posted - 14 Dec 2006 : 16:26:15
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Mbay,
That's good. "they come in milk faces and end with blood faces." That's exactly what they do. Our task at hand is to read the signs and take control before the dictator(s) gain ground. You and I have our role to serve as road blockers. That is what this exchange is about. Well done Mbay  |
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