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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 08:08:41
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I am SHOCKED. If one of your children decided NOT to be Muslim then they wouldnt be allowed to inherit? They come into the same category as MURDERERS?!  |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 08:50:53
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quote: Originally posted by gambiabev
twinkly, i cant stop laughing! LOL!!! You arent serious are you????
I think you must be taking too much valium!!!!
Twinkly my advice to you is lets try to accommodote and tolerate any extreme views in this forum in our quest to learn and develope ourselves. Life is what you make it!
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 09:32:15
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quote: Originally posted by kobo
Briefly Quotaion from the Quraan:
"From what is left by parents And those nearest related" (From my source: The interpreter resisted the temptation to translate "next to kin" as this phrase has a technical meaning in Indian Law, referring to certain kinds of jiers, whereas here the people meant are those whose inheritance is to be divided).
"There is a share for men And a share for women, wheter the property be small Or large,-a determinate share." "But if at the time of division Other relatives, or orphans, Or poor, are present, Give them out of the (property), And speak to them Words of kindness and justice." (The shares are specified. Here the general principles are laid down that females inherit as well as males, and that relatives who have no legal shares, orphans, and indigent people are not to be treated harshly, if present at the division.)
"Let those (disposing of an estate) Have the same fear in their minds As they would have for their own If they had left a helpless family behind: Let them fear Allah, and speak Appropriate words" (It is a touching argument addressed to those who have to divide an estate. @How anxious would you be if you had left a helpless family behind? If others do so, help and be kind'.
To be continued!
2nd part of my Continuation:
Allah (thus) directs you As regards your children's (inheritance): to the male, A portion equal to that Of two females: if only daughters, two or more, Their share is two-thirds Of the inheritance; If only one, her share is a half
The principles of inheritance law are laid down in broad outline in the Qu-ran: the precise details have been worked out on the basis of Prophet's practice and that of his companions, and by interpretaion and analogy. Muslim jurists have collected a vast amount of learning on this subject, and this body of law is enough by itself to form the subject of life-long study. Here we shall deal only with the broad principles to be gathered from the Text, as interpreted by the Jurists.
1) The power of testamentary disposition extends over only on-third of the Property; the remaining two-thirds are distributed among heirs as laid down.
2) All distribution takes place after the legacies and debts (including funeral expenses) have first been paid.
3) Legacies cannot be left to any of the hiers included in the sceme of distribution; or it will amount to upsetting the shares and undue preference of one heir to another.
4) Generally' but not always' the male share double that of his own category.
"A portion equal to that Of two females: if only daughters.." At first sight, the Arabic words seem to mean: "if more than two daughters." But the alternative in the next clause must mean: "if two daughters, two or more." This is the general interpretation, and is confirmed by supplementary provision (in iv. 176 at the end of the Sura, which should be raed along with this).
To be continued and next as follows:- 1) Portions allotted to a) children, and b) parents. 2) Pre-death (Inheritance) a) Will b) Next of Kin etc |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 09:38:27
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quote: Originally posted by gambiabev
I am SHOCKED. If one of your children decided NOT to be Muslim then they wouldnt be allowed to inherit? They come into the same category as MURDERERS?! 
Tried to refer to your source of interpretation in previouus postings but cannot see it. Can you help with your source; who mentioned it and / or quote it Am off but see you later! |
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Sister Omega

United Kingdom
2085 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 10:25:20
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The issue of inheritance should be discussed within the marriage and registered in the form of a will at a solicitors,court or some neutral body. The husband should stipulate how his wealth should be spilt up amongst his dependents the same rule can apply to women as well. Family dynamics vary from family to family and blanket judgements cannot be made across the board on how wealth should be distributed. But it would save a lot of confusion if spouses left wills because bereavement is a very emotional time, and an opportune moment for unscruplous people to take advantage of the situation and steal inheritance that rightfully belongs to someone else.
Peace
Sister Omega |
Peace Sister Omega |
Edited by - Sister Omega on 06 Jul 2006 10:26:25 |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 15:41:29
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quote: Originally posted by kobo
quote: Originally posted by Sister Omega
The issue of inheritance should be discussed within the marriage and registered in the form of a will at a solicitors,court or some neutral body. The husband should stipulate how his wealth should be spilt up amongst his dependents the same rule can apply to women as well. Family dynamics vary from family to family and blanket judgements cannot be made across the board on how wealth should be distributed. But it would save a lot of confusion if spouses left wills because bereavement is a very emotional time, and an opportune moment for unscruplous people to take advantage of the situation and steal inheritance that rightfully belongs to someone else.
Peace
Sister Omega
Hope to deal with that later according to interpretaion of Islamic doctrines to suit person seeking advice on an inheritance case under the "Cadis" Islamic court! It may be more equitable or vice versa according to western standards.
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 23:15:17
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quote: Originally posted by gambiabev
I am SHOCKED. If one of your children decided NOT to be Muslim then they wouldnt be allowed to inherit? They come into the same category as MURDERERS?! 
Can you refer us to your source of information or substantiate them please |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 23:33:43
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quote: Originally posted by gambiabev
I am SHOCKED. If one of your children decided NOT to be Muslim then they wouldnt be allowed to inherit? They come into the same category as MURDERERS?! 
These allegations appear to be baseless as they cannot be substantiated |
Edited by - kobo on 06 Jul 2006 23:34:04 |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 23:37:45
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Kobo
Kondorong quotes that a disbeliever cant be an heir and neither can a person committed for homicide. |
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gambiabev
United Kingdom
3091 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2006 : 23:52:55
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| I dont understand what point you are making. |
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njucks
Gambia
1131 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2006 : 00:00:20
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| Kondorong you have hit the nail. you are correct. |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2006 : 00:04:30
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by gambiabev
Kobo
Kondorong quotes that a disbeliever cant be an heir and neither can a person committed for homicide.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats different with these "I am SHOCKED. If one of your children decided NOT to be Muslim then they wouldnt be allowed to inherit? They come into the same category as MURDERERS?!"
Especially "They came into the same category of MURDERERS?" However they appear to be gross misrepresentation and wrong interpretations and I won't blame you for that as you are yet to understand Islamic doctrines. However if I were you I would try to appreciate simply the literal meanings, learn gradually and ignore the extreme views. It might be useful to get a translation of the holy Quraan and other sources of authority for further references. I have the holy Bible and Budhist books etc to study and broaden my horizon. Philosophy harmonises with sciene and religion
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Edited by - kobo on 07 Jul 2006 00:23:48 |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2006 : 00:07:31
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quote: Originally posted by njucks
Kondorong you have hit the nail. you are correct.
What do you mean you are correct? Which aspect of Kondorong's articles? Don't you realised that we are dealing with Islamic jurisprudence and complex issues |
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2006 : 01:08:50
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quote: Originally posted by kobo
quote: Originally posted by kobo
Briefly Quotaion from the Quraan:
"From what is left by parents And those nearest related" (From my source: The interpreter resisted the temptation to translate "next to kin" as this phrase has a technical meaning in Indian Law, referring to certain kinds of hiers, whereas here the people meant are those whose inheritance is to be divided).
"There is a share for men And a share for women, wheter the property be small Or large,-a determinate share." "But if at the time of division Other relatives, or orphans, Or poor, are present, Give them out of the (property), And speak to them Words of kindness and justice." (The shares are specified. Here the general principles are laid down that females inherit as well as males, and that relatives who have no legal shares, orphans, and indigent people are not to be treated harshly, if present at the division.)
"Let those (disposing of an estate) Have the same fear in their minds As they would have for their own If they had left a helpless family behind: Let them fear Allah, and speak Appropriate words" (It is a touching argument addressed to those who have to divide an estate. @How anxious would you be if you had left a helpless family behind? If others do so, help and be kind'.
To be continued!
2nd part of my Continuation:
Allah (thus) directs you As regards your children's (inheritance): to the male, A portion equal to that Of two females: if only daughters, two or more, Their share is two-thirds Of the inheritance; If only one, her share is a half
The principles of inheritance law are laid down in broad outline in the Qu-ran: the precise details have been worked out on the basis of Prophet's practice and that of his companions, and by interpretaion and analogy. Muslim jurists have collected a vast amount of learning on this subject, and this body of law is enough by itself to form the subject of life-long study. Here we shall deal only with the broad principles to be gathered from the Text, as interpreted by the Jurists.
1) The power of testamentary disposition extends over only on-third of the Property; the remaining two-thirds are distributed among heirs as laid down.
2) All distribution takes place after the legacies and debts (including funeral expenses) have first been paid.
3) Legacies cannot be left to any of the hiers included in the sceme of distribution; or it will amount to upsetting the shares and undue preference of one heir to another.
4) Generally' but not always' the male share double that of his own category.
"A portion equal to that Of two females: if only daughters.." At first sight, the Arabic words seem to mean: "if more than two daughters." But the alternative in the next clause must mean: "if two daughters, two or more." This is the general interpretation, and is confirmed by supplementary provision (in iv. 176 at the end of the Sura, which should be read along with this).
To be continued and next as follows:- 1) Portions allotted to a) children, and b) parents. 2) Pre-death (Inheritance) a) Will b) Next of Kin etc
3rd Part continuation: Your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah: and Allah is All-knowing, All-wise. (This verse deals with the portions allotted to a) children, and b) parents. The next verse deals with the portions allotted to c) husband or wife of the deceased, and d) collaterals. The children's shares are fixed, but their amount willdepend upon what goes to the parents. If both parents are living, and there are also children, both father and mother take a sixth each: if only one parent is living, he or she takes his or her sitxth; and the rest goes to the children. If the parents are living, he or she takes his or her sixth; and the rest goes to the children. If the parents areliving, and there is no child or other heir, the mother gets a third (and the father the remaining two-thirds); if there are no children, but there are brothers or sisters (this is interpreted strictly in the plural), the mother has a sixth, and the father apparently the residue, but it establishhes the proposition that children and parents have always some share if they survive, but their shares are affected by the existence and number of the heirs in these categories.)
Next I would confine myself to summarise who (beneficiaries) should inherit your wealth (under sharia)? and ignore the portions allotted because that jurisprudence is authoritative. Therefore the above examples and contributions from Janyanfara, Njucks, Kondorong and others is adequate.
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kobo

United Kingdom
7765 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jul 2006 : 08:23:53
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quote: Originally posted by kobo
quote: Originally posted by kobo
quote: Originally posted by kobo
Briefly Quotaion from the Quraan:
"From what is left by parents And those nearest related" (From my source: The interpreter resisted the temptation to translate "next to kin" as this phrase has a technical meaning in Indian Law, referring to certain kinds of hiers, whereas here the people meant are those whose inheritance is to be divided).
"There is a share for men And a share for women, wheter the property be small Or large,-a determinate share." "But if at the time of division Other relatives, or orphans, Or poor, are present, Give them out of the (property), And speak to them Words of kindness and justice." (The shares are specified. Here the general principles are laid down that females inherit as well as males, and that relatives who have no legal shares, orphans, and indigent people are not to be treated harshly, if present at the division.)
"Let those (disposing of an estate) Have the same fear in their minds As they would have for their own If they had left a helpless family behind: Let them fear Allah, and speak Appropriate words" (It is a touching argument addressed to those who have to divide an estate. @How anxious would you be if you had left a helpless family behind? If others do so, help and be kind'.
To be continued!
2nd part of my Continuation:
Allah (thus) directs you As regards your children's (inheritance): to the male, A portion equal to that Of two females: if only daughters, two or more, Their share is two-thirds Of the inheritance; If only one, her share is a half
The principles of inheritance law are laid down in broad outline in the Qu-ran: the precise details have been worked out on the basis of Prophet's practice and that of his companions, and by interpretaion and analogy. Muslim jurists have collected a vast amount of learning on this subject, and this body of law is enough by itself to form the subject of life-long study. Here we shall deal only with the broad principles to be gathered from the Text, as interpreted by the Jurists.
1) The power of testamentary disposition extends over only on-third of the Property; the remaining two-thirds are distributed among heirs as laid down.
2) All distribution takes place after the legacies and debts (including funeral expenses) have first been paid.
3) Legacies cannot be left to any of the hiers included in the sceme of distribution; or it will amount to upsetting the shares and undue preference of one heir to another.
4) Generally' but not always' the male share double that of his own category.
"A portion equal to that Of two females: if only daughters.." At first sight, the Arabic words seem to mean: "if more than two daughters." But the alternative in the next clause must mean: "if two daughters, two or more." This is the general interpretation, and is confirmed by supplementary provision (in iv. 176 at the end of the Sura, which should be read along with this).
To be continued and next as follows:- 1) Portions allotted to a) children, and b) parents. 2) Pre-death (Inheritance) a) Will b) Next of Kin etc
3rd Part continuation: Your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah: and Allah is All-knowing, All-wise. (This verse deals with the portions allotted to a) children, and b) parents. The next verse deals with the portions allotted to c) husband or wife of the deceased, and d) collaterals. The children's shares are fixed, but their amount willdepend upon what goes to the parents. If both parents are living, and there are also children, both father and mother take a sixth each: if only one parent is living, he or she takes his or her sitxth; and the rest goes to the children. If the parents are living, he or she takes his or her sixth; and the rest goes to the children. If the parents areliving, and there is no child or other heir, the mother gets a third (and the father the remaining two-thirds); if there are no children, but there are brothers or sisters (this is interpreted strictly in the plural), the mother has a sixth, and the father apparently the residue, but it establishhes the proposition that children and parents have always some share if they survive, but their shares are affected by the existence and number of the heirs in these categories.)
Next I would confine myself to summarise who (beneficiaries) should inherit your wealth (under sharia)? and ignore the portions allotted because that jurisprudence is authoritative. Therefore the above examples and contributions from Janyanfara, Njucks, Kondorong and others is adequate.
4th Part continuation: In what your wives leave, your sahre is half, if they leave no child, you get a fourth; after payment of legacies and debts. In what ye leave; their share is fourth, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an eighth; after payment of legacies and debts. (The husband takes a half of his deceased wife's property if she leaves no child, the rest going to residuaries; if she leaves a child, the husband gets only a fourth. Following, the rule that a female share is generally half the male share, the widow gets a fourth of her deceased husbands's property, if he leaves no children, and an eighth if he leaves children. If there are more widows than one, their collective share is a fourth or eight as the case may be; inter se they divide equally.) |
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